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U.S. Says No Decision So Far on Trial
AP via New York Times ^ | December 14, 2003 | By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

Posted on 12/14/2003 10:40:55 AM PST by 68skylark

BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) -- U.S. officials said they still haven't decided what to do with Saddam Hussein now that he's been captured, but one option is putting him before a special tribunal established just days ago. Iraq's Governing Council said Saddam would face public trial in Iraq.

Iraq's interim government established a special tribunal Wednesday to try top members of Saddam's government for genocide, war crimes and crimes against humanity. At the time, they said Saddam could be tried in absentia.

Lt. Gen. Richardo Sanchez said at a news conference Sunday that the U.S.-led coalition was still deciding what to do with Saddam.

``At this point, that has not been determined, we continue to process Saddam at this point in time and those issues will be resolved in the near future,'' Sanchez said.

Iraqi officials were more certain. Adnan Pachachi, a member of Iraq's Governing Council, said Saddam would face open, public trial inside Iraq. That was echoed by other members of the council as well.

``There's no question that the process will be an Iraqi process,'' Pachachi said.

Governing Council member Mouwafak al-Rabii said any trial would be conducted in accordance with international norms.

``Iraq is truly victorious now because of the arrest of the tyrant, but we won't lose sight of human rights and international standards,'' he said in Baghdad.

There was no immediate U.S. reaction to the Governing Council claims. The human rights group Amnesty International said Saddam should be given prisoner of war status, and should be allowed visits by the international Red Cross.

``Like any other criminal suspect he is entitled to all relevant safeguards under international law, including the right not to be subjected to torture or ill-treatment, and of course the right to receive a fair trial defense lawyer and the minimum safeguards as any other prisoner,'' said Nicole Shoueiry, a spokeswoman for the group.

Shoueiry said Amnesty has questions about the tribunal's legitimacy ``because it was set up without consultations with Iraqi civil society, Iraqi lawmakers and international experts and observers, including the United Nations.''

U.S. officials said the next few days and weeks will be momentous. Though Saddam's was politely talking and cooperating after his capture, officials have yet to begin the process of intensive intelligence debriefings.

The tribunal will cover crimes committed from July 17, 1968 -- the day Saddam's Baath Party came to power -- until May 1, 2003 -- the day President Bush declared major hostilities over, said Abdel-Aziz al-Hakim, the current president of the Iraqi Governing Council. Saddam became president in 1979 but wielded vast influence starting from the early 1970s.

The tribunal will try cases stemming from mass executions of Iraqi Kurds in the 1980s, as well as the suppression of uprisings by Kurds and Shiite Muslims soon after the 1991 Gulf War.

Al-Hakim said it would also try cases committed against Iran -- with which Iraq fought a bloody 1980-88 war -- and against Kuwait, which Iraq invaded in 1990, sparking the Gulf War.

The first suspects brought to trial could include top officials of Saddam's government who appeared on the U.S. 55 most-wanted list.

Some of those are already in coalition custody, including former foreign minister Tariq Aziz, former vice president Taha Yassin Ramadan and Ali Hassan al-Majid, known as ``Chemical Ali'' for his role in chemical attacks on Kurds in the 1980s.

The coalition authority now holds at least 5,500 people in detention centers, but it isn't known how many of those are war crimes suspects.

The U.S. occupation authority suspended using the death penalty, and Iraqi officials have said they will decide whether to reinstate it when a transitional government assumes sovereignty as scheduled on July 1.

The trials would be open to the public, human rights groups and news media, suggesting they could be televised. Their work is not expected to begin for months.

The legal framework also draws on international law, including Rwanda's genocide tribunal and the legal code used to create the United Nations' International Criminal Court, a body the Bush administration opposes. Al-Hakim said it would also use the Geneva Conventions as a point of reference.

Prosecutors will use a growing cache of documents seized from the former regime. Evidence also will come from the excavation of some of the 270 mass graves in Iraq that are believed to hold at least 300,000 sets of remains.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News
KEYWORDS: iraq; iraqijustice; saddam; saddamhussein; viceisclosed; warcrimestribunal
I hope this trial goes well, and goes quickly. No one wants it to go like a death penalty case in the U.S., where justice gets delayed for decades. But it's not good for an Iraqi civil society for the trial to be quick or slipshod, either. They will benefit from a full airing of the facts of Saddam's rule.

Whoever is in charge of this has got a big, tough task ahead of them.

1 posted on 12/14/2003 10:40:55 AM PST by 68skylark
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To: 68skylark
I pity the court appointed lawyer who has to defned Sodumb.
2 posted on 12/14/2003 10:47:46 AM PST by Killborn (I'd rather have Big Bizniz than Big Guvmint.)
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To: Killborn
I wonder if the administration is just waiting on instruction from China...
3 posted on 12/14/2003 10:56:49 AM PST by ARCADIA (Abuse of power comes as no surprise)
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To: ARCADIA
What do you mean?
4 posted on 12/14/2003 10:58:25 AM PST by Killborn (I'd rather have Big Bizniz than Big Guvmint.)
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To: Killborn
Despite the risks and difficulties, I bet there are tons of lawyers (in the U. S., Iraq and elsewhere) who would jump at the chance. If they don't get killed by kin of the victimes, they'll be instant stars on the world stage. Plenty of lawyers would love that.

They'll try to turn the trial into an indictment of U. S. "war crimes" in Iraq and argue that Saddam was acting for much of his career under tacit U. S. approval. They'll also say he has immunity as a head of state. Or they'll argue the trial is a zionist plot against Islam, and try to rally crowds to demonstrate or riot outside the courthouse and intimidate the judges and jurors. The whole thing could become another OJ circus, only 10 times larger.

The best model to follow might be the trials of Nazi's after WWII. The prosecutors, defense attorneys, juries and judges were all (or nearly all) military officers. I don't see how else a trial could happen.

5 posted on 12/14/2003 10:59:23 AM PST by 68skylark
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To: 68skylark
I heard Arlen Specter on CNN saying he hopes Bush takes it to the International Tribunal at the Hague so the process is legitimized by the world community. Last time I checked, the ICC doesn't even have the death penalty and I don't know how well that will play in Iraq...or within the GOP.
6 posted on 12/14/2003 10:59:51 AM PST by cwb
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To: ARCADIA
That's an odd thing to say.
7 posted on 12/14/2003 10:59:54 AM PST by 68skylark
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To: 68skylark
Good idea. A viable alternative is to use Iraqi lawyers, judges, jurors. Americans and Coalition provide security and evidence.
8 posted on 12/14/2003 11:02:40 AM PST by Killborn (I'd rather have Big Bizniz than Big Guvmint.)
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To: 68skylark
Poll question: "How would you punish Saddam?"

a) feed him to a shredder.
b) let him be beaten by the shoes of the Iraqi people.
c) left in prison to rot.
d) forced to view the collected Senate speeches of Robert Byrd.
e) hang autopsy photos of Udai and Qusai autographed by both President Bushes.
f) forced to watch the collective performances of Barbra Streisand.

(still looking for better alternatives).

9 posted on 12/14/2003 11:07:28 AM PST by Tall_Texan ("Is Rush a Hypocrite?" http://righteverytime2.blogspot.com)
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To: Killborn
Yeah. It's best if Iraqis take care of him. But on the other hand, Iraqi judges and jurors might be subject to all kinds of bribery, violence or threats from pro-Saddam forces. In this country it's hard to have a trial of organized crime figures, because they find ways to "get to" jurors. It would be far worse in Iraq. Maybe the Iraqi military can form a strong JAG corps in the next few years, and they can run the trial (with friendly help from us).

I'm a pure amateur at this sort of thing -- I guess my only point is that it's going to be a complicated mess for someone to figure out. But that's why we have smart people in charge of these things!

10 posted on 12/14/2003 11:18:02 AM PST by 68skylark
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To: Killborn
(Oh, and it looks like you're still new enough that I can say 'welcome to FR.' I hope you're finding this to be an enjoyable and educational place -- I know I do.)
11 posted on 12/14/2003 11:20:25 AM PST by 68skylark
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To: 68skylark
I'm glad I'm not one of those smart people. They've got a huge task ahead of them. May they succeed with the grace of God.
12 posted on 12/14/2003 11:26:07 AM PST by Killborn (I'd rather have Big Bizniz than Big Guvmint.)
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To: 68skylark
Thank you for welcoming me. :) I love it here! I'm proud to call myself a Freeper.

Tis a great day to be an American. :) People who say America is bad are total morons. We have liberated more than we have ever harmed.

God bless America and all her defenders, past, present, future.
13 posted on 12/14/2003 11:28:55 AM PST by Killborn (I'd rather have Big Bizniz than Big Guvmint.)
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To: Killborn
People who say America is bad are total morons.

That's very well said. Can't argue.

14 posted on 12/14/2003 11:32:47 AM PST by 68skylark
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To: Tall_Texan
a) feed him to a shredder.
b) let him be beaten by the shoes of the Iraqi people.
c) left in prison to rot.
d) forced to view the collected Senate speeches of Robert Byrd.
e) hang autopsy photos of Udai and Qusai autographed by both President Bushes.
f) forced to watch the collective performances of Barbra Streisand.

Why not all?

15 posted on 12/14/2003 11:38:25 AM PST by woofer
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To: 68skylark
That's an odd thing to say.

I was a bit disappointed with the administration's position on Taiwan last week, and I hope that we are not equally flexible on how we choose to handle Saddam. I would hate to see him turn over to either the UN or the "World Court"; but, I wouldn't be at all surprised.
16 posted on 12/14/2003 1:51:14 PM PST by ARCADIA (Abuse of power comes as no surprise)
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To: ARCADIA
Oh. That makes sense. I didn't understand your reference to China in a thread about Saddam, but now I think I see what you're driving at. And I agree that the UN or a "World Court" would be a horrible choice -- only the hardcore pro-Saddam folks (including most of the 9 dwarves) would argues for that option.

Everything I've read indicates that they want to try Saddam in an open Iraqi court. I'm not sure how I feel about that -- sounds like a good idea in theory, but pulling it off could be super-difficult.

And I'd say Saddam is way too dangerous to keep alive -- as long as he's alive there's always a chance some of his military will try to bust him out of prison, or take hostages somewhere to demand his release, or plan a coup to bring him back to power. I think we'd all agree that he needs to be executed quickly after his fair trial is over.

17 posted on 12/14/2003 2:13:38 PM PST by 68skylark
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To: 68skylark
I say hold the trial before the UN General Council. Make them feel the shame of their cowardace when the evidence is presented. Mind you the trial will be conducted by US military court, not the UN. Any disruption from the gallery will be dealt with by the USMC seargents at arms.
18 posted on 12/14/2003 5:06:52 PM PST by anymouse
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