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White House verifies immigration review
The Washington Times ^ | December 12, 2003 | Jerry Seper

Posted on 12/12/2003 12:05:21 AM PST by yonif

Edited on 07/12/2004 3:40:59 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

The White House yesterday said a new immigration review is under way that could lead to amnesty for millions of illegal aliens living and working in the United States.

Confirmation of the review came during a White House briefing, just two days after Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge said during a town hall meeting in Miami that the government had to "afford some kind of legal status" to the 8 million to 12 million illegal aliens in the country.


(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Government; Mexico; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aliens; amnesty; illegalaliens; illegalimmigration; illegals; immigrantlist; immigration; jerryseper; republicanturncoats; tomridge; whitehouse
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To: AmericanInTokyo
to photocopy that cancelled 2000 check to the Bush Campaign last time

A great idea. I have already done so verbally, but a copy of what is NOT coming sounds good. I still wonder though if money is the key. It is the votes that will be most important.

201 posted on 12/12/2003 8:32:40 AM PST by Marak (Let me turn you on to Fantasy.)
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To: grania
They are an "invasion force"?
How many do you think even know, much less care about "la Reconquista" or "la Roza"?
202 posted on 12/12/2003 8:32:56 AM PST by Central_Floridian
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To: yonif
As much as I think of GW on most issues, I can neither support or defend this amnesty BS for illegals of any kind.

Even if i reward my children for bad behavior they will surely repeat it, even increase it. The same would happen with the border.

I hope Bush trashes this lame idea because it will not help him with either Mexican American votes or Republicans., Even worse its just plain wrong to do.

Mexican Americans are a great asset to America.

Illegals of any kind are not. The cheap labor they provided just wont be cheap anymore. Thats the price to pay for security.

203 posted on 12/12/2003 8:37:01 AM PST by No Blue States
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To: William Terrell
Most conservatives that I know think that the Poles, the Vietnamese, and the Chinese who have come to America have contributed to the freedom, security, and well-being of these United States.
Do you think otherwise?
I know some people from other countries who are firm believers in liberty, more so than many native Americans.
204 posted on 12/12/2003 8:37:26 AM PST by Central_Floridian
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To: Central_Floridian
I know that many people say "they (the Latinos) should fix their own country instead of coming here."

That's not true. Only race baiters like you say "Latinos should fix their own country." The rest of us say "Mexicans should fix their own country." 'Mexican' is a nationality not a race. Most of the other immigrants you described came here legally.

I read in a newspaper a while ago that our immigration laws have changed little in the past eighty years since they were developed by Hitler-admiring eugenists ...

Then how did the Eastern-Europeans, the Russians and the Vietnamese get here? They all came in the last eighty years. You've been reading leftist propaganda. Stop it it rots the mind.

205 posted on 12/12/2003 8:40:31 AM PST by TigersEye ("Where there is life there is hope!" - Terri Schiavo)
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To: B Knotts
I think the whole "we want to appeal to Latino voters" is a head-fake. They are really trying to appeal to the bidnessmen who employ the illegals.

You're dead on.

206 posted on 12/12/2003 8:42:29 AM PST by truthkeeper
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To: Central_Floridian
"There are simply so many regulations that it is almost impossible to not break one."

Get real - making excuses like the above in no way can justify the criminal acts of the illegals. My paternal ancestors were here before there was a USA. My maternal ancestors fled Ireland after one of the brothers was hung for treason against the English crown - and they had to change from Catholic to protetant because of the way catholics were treated here in the early 1800's.

"There is a difference I believe, between someone who violates a regulation and someone who has no respect for other's rights."

By violating the laws of the country you are entering is proof positive that the violator has no respect for the rights of US citizens.
207 posted on 12/12/2003 8:45:00 AM PST by familyofman
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To: adam_az
Would they have if immigration law was the same then as it is now?
I have an idea. Set up checkpoints on the border. If someone comes to them wanting to enter the US their records are checked for criminal activity. If they have not committed any crimes they are allowed into the US. If they want to become a citizen they must speak, understand, read and write English; they must demonstrate a good understanding of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights; they must not belong to a belief or group (Wahabbism, Communism, the Atzlanti nuts for example) that opposes what the US stands for.
Would you oppose this idea?
208 posted on 12/12/2003 8:46:49 AM PST by Central_Floridian
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To: Central_Floridian
They are an "invasion force"? How many do you think even know, much less care about "la Reconquista" or "la Roza"?

I just checked your Freeper background, and saw that you signed up in April 2003, and you were (or are) a home-schooled HS Senior.

First, let me say that this is wonderful. It's much better to learn about the immigration issues here than to be force-fed the "everything is wonderful about our friends from other countries" nonsense in the public schools.

Do they know they are an invasion force? Especially with the Mexicans, every indication from things that have been posted from a Mexico City newspaper is that yes, they do. Vincente Fox's actions and demands, and some of the quotes you'll read in some articles, indicate that the goal is to turn most of the SW United States into part of a greater Mexico.

You might want to get your name on the lists of people to be pinged about border issues. At times, the maps, the outrageous demands, and the attitude of we US citizens can't live without their labor will come up.

You seem to be a very intelligent, thoughtful person for your age group. It might be harder for you to see the impact this invasion has had on our culture, safety, education, and economics because you don't have the basis of comparison that us older folks do.

Keep on freepin'...

209 posted on 12/12/2003 8:52:38 AM PST by grania ("Won't get fooled again")
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To: Central_Floridian
Re your post 208: I have a better idea. Guard the border, shut down all illegal immigration. Reform the immigration laws to allow far fewer legal immigrants. The fewer legal immigrants that will be allowed in will be admitted based upon the skills they can bring to this country: education, job training, etc. The Mexicans who have immigrated into my area have few job skills and are prominent for making appearances in our local newspaper's criminal report column. We do not need this. This nation does not need masses of ill-educated, poorly trained peoples streaming over our borders, illegally or legally.
210 posted on 12/12/2003 8:54:50 AM PST by reelfoot
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To: Central_Floridian
...they must not belong to a belief or group (Wahabbism, Communism, the Atzlanti nuts for example) that opposes what the US stands for.

Hey that's good! We simply ask everyone who comes in to the U.S. "Do you plan on subverting our laws and/or committing terrorist acts?" and if they answer "yes" we send them back. Brilliant!

Get Tom Ridge on the line and let him know what you came up with.

Now how do we get the questionaires to the ones who are sneaking in at night and in the backs of freight trucks?

211 posted on 12/12/2003 8:54:56 AM PST by TigersEye ("Where there is life there is hope!" - Terri Schiavo)
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To: *immigrant_list; A Navy Vet; Lion Den Dan; Free the USA; Libertarianize the GOP; madfly; B4Ranch; ..
ping
212 posted on 12/12/2003 8:56:16 AM PST by gubamyster
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To: yonif
This is a trial balloon sent up by the Bush administartion to see if amnesty is feasable in the current political atmostphere. Prior to 9-11, 80%-85% of American's opposed amnesty and I don't think thats changed in two years.

Personally, I think PresBush would be seriously damaging his re-election chances by offering to give any form to amnesty to illegal aliens. But then again, I thought the USSC would throw out CFR. So what do I know.

Since Bush receieved little opposition from within the GOP's majority base of conservatives, on legislation that ranged from increased spending on education, farm subsidies and the new Medicare PDP, may be the Bush people think this is the right time to seek passage of some limited amnesty program. Say for about five million illegals.

Wonder if Bush, Cheney and Rove feel that confident about re-election and are that willing to spend political capital on the issue of amnesty. We shall see.

213 posted on 12/12/2003 9:02:00 AM PST by Reagan Man (The few, the proud, the conservatives.)
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To: Central_Floridian
Here's some information for you. Any text in bold was done by me and not the author:

Upholding the Immigration Laws: No Large-Scale Amnesty for Illegal Immigrants
Seth H. Harris
April 23, 2001

      Should the United States ever grant another amnesty to persons who have illegally immigrated to the United States since January 1, 1982?

      Since Congress approved the last large-scale general amnesty for illegal immigrants in the United States in 1986, people throughout the world have debated whether it accomplished its goals and whether the United States government would grant another amnesty in the future. Proponents of another amnesty argue that there are many illegal immigrants in the nation that live in fear of deportation by the Immigration and Naturalization Service. They also say that employers exploit illegal immigrant labor and that adjusting the residency status of the aliens would help protect their human rights under the Constitution (Whalen 28).

      As the number of illegal aliens estimated in the United States continues to increase, human rights advocates and many members of Congress have been pressing for another large-scale amnesty for these aliens (Cheng A16). Although the arguments of amnesty proponents are valid, another large-scale amnesty would discriminate against foreign nationals awaiting permission to enter the United States, hurt the United States economy, and create a mockery of the United States immigration laws.

      In 1986, the United States Congress passed the Immigration Reform and Control Act, which essentially created a "guest worker" program that allowed for temporary admission for certain types of employment, sanctions against employers who hire undocumented workers, and a large-scale general amnesty for illegal immigrants who have resided in the United States continuously since January 1, 1982 (Briggs 163).

      The amnesty allowed approximately three million illegal immigrants that were not excludable to automatically adjust their national status to permanent resident alien without penalty. This was necessary because many of the immigration laws prior to 1986 were ambiguous and were misinterpreted by immigrants.

      Also, the amnesty was supposed to alleviate the high number of illegal aliens residing in the United States and allow the Immigration and Naturalization Service and the border patrol to start a stricter policy of border enforcement (Edwards 4A). It should also be understood that the bill passed Congress under the assumption that it would be a one-time amnesty and that future illegal entry into the country would be punished.

      Therefore, it is the responsibility of law enforcement officials to ensure that illegal immigrants are barred from entering the nation and those who have already entered the nation are punished and deported. Implementing another large-scale general amnesty would contradict the United States' assertion of discouraging illegal aliens from entering the nation (Geyer 19A).

      One important reason for not permitting another general amnesty is that it rewards lawbreakers and discriminates against foreign nationals that are currently in their home country awaiting permission to enter the United States.  Amnesties encourage illegal aliens to enter the United States and avoid authorities until the government allows them to legally adjust their national status.

      According to the Christian Science Monitor, "another amnesty would send a signal to those foreigners seeking to migrate to the US that they too should risk dangerous passage, endure unscrupulous employers, and hide out for years in hopes of yet another amnesty (Illegal 10)."

      As a result of the 1986 amnesty provision, a large influx of aliens entered the United States in hopes of gaining another amnesty that Congress is debating.  By 1997, five million illegal immigrants were estimated to be living in the United States (Mendieta 23). This shows that by granting an amnesty, the government not only gives no incentive for following the Immigration and Naturalization Service procedure in applying for an immigrant visa, but also encourages more illegal immigrants to enter the country.

      If the United States government wants to legitimize its immigration laws, it must enforce them to the best of its ability. They must not contradict these laws or risk having more foreign nationals disregard them.

      It has been recommended that a compromise be reached and grant a general amnesty to those illegal immigrants who pay a fine to the Immigration and Naturalization Service (Mendieta 23). This is not a worthwhile alternative because it would create a market for United States citizenship and would grant an immigrant visa only to those immigrants that could afford to pay.

      Citizenship is not a commodity and should not be able to be bought at any price by anybody. Also, even if a fine were implemented, it would be discriminatory to favor nationals of wealthy nations over those of poor nations. Not only would this create an imbalance of immigrants from different countries, it would not give each person an equal opportunity to achieve national status in the United States. Therefore, in order to give each person an equal opportunity to enter the United States legally and achieve national status, the government must not grant a general amnesty.

      Another large-scale general amnesty could also create major economic problems for the economy of the United States. According to the New York Times, illegal aliens in the United States cost the federal government twenty-five billion dollars annually in 1984. This accounts for emergency services, health visits, and other social welfare programs that any person in the nation receives (King A20).

      It is very difficult to determine the national status of a person prior to providing them with these essential services. Therefore, illegal immigrants receive these services at the expense of taxpaying citizens. Also, illegal immigrants that work in low-paying, non-skilled positions in the United States displace legal employees from jobs (Edwards 4A). Illegal immigrants will often accept extremely low wages jobs so that they will have just enough money on which to live. This makes them more attractive to employers because they can get the same quality of labor at a considerably lower price.

      According to a study by Donald L. Huddle, professor of labor economics at Rice University, "for every one hundred illegal aliens working in the United States, sixty-five United States workers lose their jobs (King A20)." By following this formula, about three million Americans are currently unemployed because of illegal immigrant labor. This costs taxpayers eighteen billion dollars in unemployment insurance each year (King A20).

      This is not fair to legal workers that have to support a family and earn a living wage. While hard working, unskilled American workers are being displaced, the wage levels of the lowest paid jobs are pushed even lower. Thus, as the wage level is forced down, it becomes harder to earn a living wage. In order to protect American workers from being displaced and to ensure the financial stability of the United States economy, illegal immigrants should not be granted an amnesty.

      In order to maintain the integrity of our immigration laws and avoid the need for another amnesty similar to the one granted in 1986, the United States must solve the problem of illegal immigration at its source. This means that the United States must commit itself to a strict enforcement of its immigration laws. This would include stricter border controls, regular audits of employers' I-9 forms, and deporting any and all illegal immigrant found in the nation, consistent with current laws. The United States needs to portray itself as a nation that takes its laws seriously and follows them consistently (Hollingsworth 15).

      In order to do this properly, the government must follow the same guidelines in each and every case for admitting foreign nationals to the United States. The Immigration and Naturalization Service would not have to explain its reasons for its admission decision in each case because it would be following strict guidelines. For example, proponents of an amnesty argue that illegal aliens that have children born in the United States should be granted amnesty (Keep 10). This could create one of the largest loopholes in immigration history. It would encourage illegal aliens to enter the United States, have a child, and be automatically granted permanent resident alien status.

      It would be much more organized if the government required all illegal immigrants to return to their native country, either with or without their child, and apply for an immigrant visa before returning. This would ensure that each prospective immigrant is given an equal opportunity to enter the United States, give more consistency to the legal immigration process, and allow the United States government to more accurately control who is granted an immigrant visa. It would not be inhumane because it would just require all foreign nationals to go through the same process for applying for permanent resident alien status.

      Another large-scale general amnesty must not be granted because it would undermine the integrity of the United States immigration laws. It would be demeaning to the border patrol because the government would essentially be encouraging illegal aliens to avoid authorities in order to gain national status. Without a strict controlling of entry into the United States, the governmentÂ's national sovereignty would be greatly compromised.  This would then make it more difficult to enforce internal laws. The first, and supposedly one-time, general amnesty in 1986 was designed to reduce overall illegal immigration, but instead had the opposite effect.

      It is argued by proponents of another amnesty that the illegal immigrants that have been in the nation for many years are working and have families (Whalen 28). Although this would finally allow illegal immigrants to obtain national status, the United States cannot simply take a humanitarian approach toward them while harming the American people and economic stability. Therefore, the United States Congress must take into consideration the negative effects that such a large-scale amnesty might have on the nation and whether granting this amnesty would even accomplish its goal.

Works cited and source of the article:
http://people.cornell.edu/pages/shh22/amnesty.doc
OR here.

214 posted on 12/12/2003 9:02:22 AM PST by DumpsterDiver
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To: TigersEye
Quote from Tigereye: That's not true. Only race baiters like you say "Latinos should fix their own country." The rest of us say "Mexicans should fix their own country." 'Mexican' is a nationality not a race.
First, I would like to ask you how you know that I have or have not heard "Latinos should fix their own country"?
If you know what someone who comments on a web-board from miles away who you have never seen has or has not heard I suggest you apply to the FBI. Such abilities would be very useful to them.
Secondly, I meant to say "Latinos should fix their own countries" not "country." I am perfectly aware of the fact that Mexico is a nation.
215 posted on 12/12/2003 9:02:50 AM PST by Central_Floridian
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To: Central_Floridian
I might, but it's moot, because it will never ever happen. I also hope for world peace, even though I know it's a pipe dream.
216 posted on 12/12/2003 9:02:50 AM PST by adam_az
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To: goldstategop; All
FYI, Immigration law provided for a rolling amnesty program IF you have been in the USA for at least 10 years. (It used to be six but the Republicans forced it to 10)

In other words, illegals who can hide and create enough roots to establish a "hardship" for leaving are rewarded.

I don't believe they should be rewarded at all. Hardship or not. Anchor babies or not. (tell the minor to call the USA when they are 18)

However, if they do adopt some amensty, they should prurge the rolling amnesty out of the books. In other words if an amnesty is adopted, the 10 year hide and seek rule is purged from the books.
217 posted on 12/12/2003 9:04:14 AM PST by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: TigersEye
You said "how did the Eastern-Europeans, the Russians and the Vietnamese get here?"
My understanding is that many didn't. They were killed by the dictators who siezed control of their countries. I'm sure many have seen the photos of Vietnamese desperately trying to get into rising helicopters to escape the NVA.
218 posted on 12/12/2003 9:06:59 AM PST by Central_Floridian
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To: goldstategop
Those that are now in power, quake not at our rantings. Republicans are elected to move the Democrats agenda forward, and the reverse is also true. There is only a difference in personality and rhetoric between the parties, and it is patently obvious. Clinton advances Welfare Reform, and Bush gives us bigger govt. Someones agenda is being advanced, and it is the people that believe in conservatism, and historical Americanism.
219 posted on 12/12/2003 9:07:00 AM PST by jeremiah (Sunshine scares all of them, for they all are cockaroaches)
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To: Mo1
So go right ahead and keep blaming Bush for everything under the sun .. and don't vote for him

How about writing in Tom Tancredo? If enough of us do it... who knows?

220 posted on 12/12/2003 9:08:28 AM PST by Reaganwuzthebest
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