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To: Loc123
1) Science is still based on the faith that our eyes/other senses accurately report the universe. We also assume our brains themselves accurately synthesize those stimuli. For practical purposes we are correct--still, it is a faith.

No, we don't have faith in any such thing. If our eyes tell us something that doesn't jibe with what we already know, we test it by other means. If you saw a bar of lead floating in water, you wouldn't think, "Oh, I guess lead floats after all." You'd test by other means. We subject things to tests all the time. If they behave in a consistent manner we decide that that is what can be expected of them. But there's no faith involved, there is a constant testing and re-testing.

2) Actually, we never imagine infinite. We can right symbols that to us mean "really big number." But no, we cannot actually grasp infinite.

Well, "imagine" and "grasp" aren't the same thing.

3) The Law of Identity is not a law, it is a philosophical criterion. Interestingly, the "law" itself falls before its own assumptions; it cannot explain anything metaphysical.

Can you give me an example?

386 posted on 12/07/2003 9:35:22 AM PST by wizardoz
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To: wizardoz
1) I think you are misunderstanding my point. We have a level of faith that our eyes accurately report our scientific measurements. We have faith our brains accurately synthesize the info from those measuring devices. I am not talking about mirages here.

2) I'm sorry, but infinite is beyond any understanding. To us it will seem like a huge number, but being infinite we cannot truly even think about it. If you truly believe you can understand, think about--whatever the word-- about infinite then you are either crazy or the Creator. I mean this as a throwback jest, not an insult.

3) Sure. From what I've read, this "law" is basically explaining the limits of our measurement of the universe. It states we cannot measure something that is not in the universe; we cannot measure something metaphysical. Therefore, it is beyond our comprehension. If you truly have faith in this philosophical idea, then you cannot then imagine (or whatever word you want) infinite. But if you believe this in addition to believing you can imagine infinite, then that is cognitive dissonance (agreeing with something but not following it).

Anyways, these are really minor points in the larger debate. If you have any questions about Christianity or the probability of a Creator I would love to answer them :)
399 posted on 12/07/2003 8:36:03 PM PST by Loc123
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