Indecisive nutrition 'experts' should leave us alone [Bread will kill you, keep the cows off Atkins]

.thecountrytoday ^ | 11-12-03

[SJackson]

And now, the 2003 Nutritional Villain of the Year is - may I have a drum roll, please! - bread.

That's right, folks, the staff of life turns out to be a stake through your heart, if you read the latest reports. Bread makes you fat, they say.

Bread-phobia appears to be almost entirely due to the Atkins diet and all its low or no-carb permutations that have recently swept the country. The basic idea is that if you eat only meat, dairy products and vegetables you'll feel full and lose weight.

Bread sales across the country are falling like punched-down dough as chubby consumers shy away from carbohydrates. I heard all about this for the second or third time on a radio program on the way to work the other day. They were interviewing bakers who were wondering what to do to revive sales. Maybe they need a bread check-off.

Studies and anecdotal experience show that the Atkins diet works, at least in the short term. Close to home, both my parents lost weight in the first year. In recent months they haven't.

One veterinarian I chatted with about the diet wondered what happens to people's livers when they're on the Atkins diet for long periods of time. He knows what happens to cows that eat too much protein and not enough roughage.

Wasn't it just a few years ago that bread was the culinary darling du jour? But as with so many other foods, fame has proven to be treacherous. Look what happened to eggs, butter, chocolate and red meat. Two or three decades ago the once-beloved egg was suddenly renamed as the great villain, a nasty little thing that raised your cholesterol and gave you heart attacks.

Then real butter came under attack, and we were all supposed to eat margarine. Dairy products in general, once a cornerstone of the nutriiton pyramid, were suddenly discovered to be fattening and bad for you. So much for my childhood instructions to "drink lots of milk for strong bones."

The next victim was red meat. I don't remember exactly what the reasoning was behind that vilification, but we were to substitute with chicken and fish. Chocolate got a nutritional hatchet job for being fattening, probably because we love it so much. But that was then.

Now eggs are OK to eat again, since they're wonderfully complete nutritional packages. Cholesterol evidently has more to do with your genetic inheritance than your diet, though diet is still important for those who need to bring their levels under control.

Butter has been found to be better for your blood vessels than margarine, and red meat is great for adding vitamins and minerals to your diet, especially iron. Chocolate is a mood elevator and teeth protector. I knew all along it made me feel better; now many experts agree.

In the past two years many nutritionists have restored dairy products to a place of honor as the best source of calcium for a calcium defiecient nation. Several recent large studies have also shown that dairy is an aid to weight loss. The calcium and perhaps other components in dairy products have the effect of speeding up the metabolism, so you burn calories faster.

In the 1973 movie "Sleeper," actor Woody Allen played a vegetarian California health-food store owner who is cryogenically frozen and then thawed out 200 years later.

After he's properly re-warmed, his hosts offer him - to his horror - a healthy meal of steak and brownies to restore him to good health.

The scene was hilarious then; now it's spooky because it's coming true.

Of course, not all nutritional experts agree that eggs, meat, milk and butter are good guys again, but the tide has certainly turned.

I have great hopes that in a few years this smear campaign against bread will blow over and carbohydrates will be restored to their proper place in the national diet.

Before nutrition became a polticial issue, grade school students, myself included, were taught a pretty simple, user-friendly program for staying healthy and slim. The gist of it was that everyone should eat three moderate - moederate is a key concept, here - well-balanced meals each day.

Well-balanced meant a combination of meat and dairy, fruits and vegetables, and breads and starches. It did not mean a continuous intake of nutritionally worthless, high-calorie pop, chips and candy.

We were a slimmer nation back then.

Maybe it's not so much what you eat, but how much, and how much you exercise. Not a revolutionary thought, exactly, but one that might be usefully revived from the dustbin of nutritional history.

Ann Hansen covers news in west-central Wisconsin and is the small acreage section editor for The Country Today. She may be reached at shansen@bloomer.net.

[miele man]

Those cows just need to find a patch of milk thistle. That'll take care of their liver problem.

[Redwood71]

"Like most people that bash Atkin's you seem to have no grasp of the way of eating that he called for."------

This isn’t just me “bashing” Atkins. I’ve worked in the field for over 30 years and I have not yet found a low carb high protein diet that works because just as soon as you go off it, you gain it back. And all the low carb diets, with time, create a consistent pattern of health risks.

You do what you want. Your genes will tell you more than anything if you listen to them. If the dieter doesn’t take the time, and do things in moderation, and find what works and stay with it, then there is failure too often and health risks way too much.

If you find the time, read the below sites. This is just a tiny part of what I have read.

I am not going to sit around and get shot at when I am voicing an opinion. I walked away from another site with people that were listening to the hype from someone trying to sell something, and not the possibilities.

Happy New Year

Red

http://www.diet-i.com/diets/high-protein-diets.htm

http://www.ivillage.com/food/experts/nutrition/qas/0,,242253_90078,00.html

http://www.vegsource.com/articles/protein.danger.htm

http://www.health24.co.za/dietnfood/Weight_Centre/15-51-85,19916.asp

http://msnbc.msn.com/Default.aspx?id=3541399&p1=0

http://www.fitwoman.com/fitbriefings/protein.shtml

http://content.health.msn.com/content/article/77/95324.htm

[jaj_dad]

I have not yet found a low carb high protein diet that works because just as soon as you go off it, you gain it back.

Had to respond to this part - can you find me a "diet" where you don't gain it back after you stop dieting?

I've been doing Atkins this past year (lost 25, holidays put back about 10). The underlying aspect to Atkins (and most diets) is a lifestyle change - you need to keep up with your changed eating habits, because that is what caused you to lose your weight (your original habits caused you to put it on :-)

[Nov3]

The body needs carbs to run just like a car needs gas.

False - the body has NO need of carbohydrates and can survive indefinitely without them.

The body runs out of energy during extended draw, and there have been numerous problems with stones like was mentioned.

Actually during any thing more than 45 minutes of strenuous exercise carbs are a non issue. Run for 45 minutes and your body exhausts its glycogen. You are burning fat. As to the kidney stones - the standard elevated calcium argument that is run out is moot. After 6 or so weeks on low carb levels normalize.

I recommend a balanced diet with no less than 50% carbs and preferred 60%.

I will stick with Atkins and the Eades and Wolfgang Lutz. That diet may work for an athlete but anyone who lives a normal life will steadily become a hog.

Don't be fooled like a lot of people with one-size-fits-all books about weight loss that are written to make money and don't tell the whole truth all the time. They are the illusion of health, not the reality. Short term weight loss is not the answer to good health. And these diets can be nothing else but short term as the longer you stay on these diets, the better the chance of the fore mentioned health problems.

Well my Wife and I have been on the diet 7 years. We both are lighter, have no digestion problems, (at least when my wife is not pregant or breastfeeding) no need for Prosac or Zantac, dramatically fewer headaches, better skin, rock stable blood sugar etc. When we were eating 50 to 60 % carb that wasn't the case.

It is you who has been fooled by one size fits all diets. Fat consumption has fallen from ~40% to ~32% from 1970 to the present with an associate rise in carb consumption. This is a dream scenario for all of your nutrition teachers however strangely enough obesity and diabetes have EXPLODED! By your reasoning things should have gone the other way. But don't let the facts get in the way of a good Hypothesis! Doctor Atkins has been talking about the effect of excess carb consumption for years. What did he say was the ultimate outcome? Obesity and Diabetes. He called it Diabesity. The clowns who said he was wrong want us to cut out more fat and eat more grain!!!! Give me good meat, green and yellow vegetables, dairy and fish thank you.

Read Wolfgang Lutz's book "Life without Bread". The Eades' "Protein Power Life Plan", later Atkins books, Mercola's books including "The No Grain Diet" etc.

I have been reading the opposition for years. I bought the low fat BS. I believed in "the carbohydrate advantage". I was wrong. My wife gave me a book that allowed me to look at the ridiculous Atkins' point of view. It was Protein Power. If she had given me Atkins' book I would not have read it and investigated further. It would have been my loss.

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation."

-Herbert Spencer-

[Nov3]

I’ve worked in the field for over 30 years and I have not yet found a low carb high protein diet that works because just as soon as you go off it, you gain it back.

What kind of BS is this. If you go off of any diet IT DOESN'T WORK.

Let me ask you a personal question - are you a vegetarian? a lacto vegetarian? Looking at your links it sure seems that way! Good luck and take plenty of supplements if you are(especially B12 because vegans are universally deficient) Doesn't matter that essential vitamins and minerals are missing vegans say that that is our "natural" diet!

[Finalapproach29er]

thanks.

[Redwood71]

No, I am not a vegetarian. I believe, and was taught by Cooper's, in a balanced diet that includes a source of carbs, protein, and fat. Basically 60/15/25. To get in shape, and remain that way, there will have to be the use of exercise. It includes aerobics, weight training (resistence), and a form of stretching called plyometrics. All lead to a well rounded exercise program. Diet by itself, will not get someone fit, just thin. This can even go far enough to cause death in extreme cases.

If you read the articles I displayed, you'll see a consistent run of medical problems from a large number of people using different "diets" geared toward protein. Stones, heart problems, kidney ailments, ketosis, and more seem to pop up with a great enough regularity that I feel where there's smoke, there could be fire. You also mentioned that aspect of energy? The man that told me about the lack of was my doctor who was on the Atkins and ran out of gas on a 5 mile run. He had to hitch a ride back. He stopped the Atkins and no longer recommended it. Protein does not supply energy.

Like I said, you do what you want to do. I wish you well. The term diet is whatever you eat over time. It can be a balanced and complete diet, or a lousy one. Your choice. You can say you haven't had any problems and that's great. Many have and they are documented through recognized medical institutions. Finally, I will say that with these documentations in mind, if someone wishes to start a change in their dietary intake, and they are shopping, I wish them luck, but I can't recommend a diet that has so much of a negative findings history. And that you can't ignore.

[Nov3]

I wish them luck, but I can't recommend a diet that has so much of a negative findings history. And that you can't ignore.

Contempt prior to investigation. You are hopelessly brainwashed and cannot look at the other side. I was there but saw the light. I hope you get the truth so you don't lead anyone else astray.

Good Luck

[Age of Reason]

At the very least, bread rots your teeth.

It could not therefore be a food man evolved to eat, as no species would naturally evolve to eat something that destroys the species means to ingest food.


I would not be surprised to learn that in addition to causing tooth decay bread does other harm to humans.

[steveo]

I like to drink my bread.

[Ladysmith]

I would not be surprised to learn that in addition to causing tooth decay bread does other harm to humans.

Spina bifida in babies is linked with cornflakes and white bread

[Redwood71]

Yeah, these people haven't investigated either. I guess me and all these others are really leading people astray:

John Hopkins

http://www.hopkinsafter50.com/html/silos/diabetes/wpARTICLE_diets.php

Bassett Research Institute

http://www2.uiuc.edu/ro/cvs/Atkins.html

Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine,

http://www.atkinsdietalert.org/

The American Heart Association

http://www.cnn.com/2001/HEALTH/diet.fitness/03/20/protein.diet.heart/

University of South Dakota School of Medicine

http://med.usd.edu/family/hfactor/1999/99maypg3.htm

American Diabetes Assn

http://www.healthbulletin.org/diabetes/diabetes13.htm

UC Berkley School of Medicine

http://www.berkeleywellness.com/html/wl/2000/wlFeatured0400.html

Like I said, you have your opinion based upon what someone has told you trying to sell you something, I go with better investigations than that. So much for contempt prior to investigation.

Good luck and I hope your luck continues with your health.

Red

[Nov3]

Did a lot of culling to get those ehh. I don't have time to do internet search for you besides you are too far gone until a few of your gurus come to their senses!

[Teacher317]

By the way, the Atkins brand shakes, chocolate bars, and ice cream are very good... you don't have to avoid the brand name altogether. But Breyers low-carb ice cream is the best.

[SamAdams76]

I'll have to side with Nov3 on this issue. I too was a critic of the low-carb diets and parroted the government's food pyramids and such. During this time, I was over 100 pounds overweight and was convinced that it was my lack of willpower to go on the standard low-fat diet (like the one you posted about) that kept me fat. Even though I tried a low-fat diet multiple times and kept giving them up because the constant hunger pangs made my life miserable. Being that I never seemed to lose more than 20 pounds on a low-fat diet (which still left me plenty fat) I figured that life was too short to be miserable and so accepted the fact that I would always be fat.

On a whim, I decided to give this low-carb thing a try last April. It wasn't Atkins. But close to it. I simply tried cutting out all processed junk food from my diet (which contains most of the carbs anyhow) and ate only natural foods. I still had carbs, but they came from natural sources like berries, yogurt, nuts and vegetables instead of unnatural sources like cookies, cakes, pies, chips and crackers.

I started losing weight quickly. My energy level also increased dramatically so that I not only was able to start a vigorous exercise program, but I actually wanted to exercise. Now when I sit in a chair, I unconsciously start rocking myself or shaking my legs because I have so much energy built up inside of me (which was something I used to do as a kid). As the exercise increased, the weight loss intensified. I went from 300 pounds to 196 pounds within seven months. (Average weight for my 6'3" frame is 185-190 so I am pretty much where I need to be now.)

Now I'm not saying that this diet will work for everybody. But it did work for me and I know it worked for others. I cannot possibly imagine it being an unhealthy diet because it consists of all the foods that humans have been eating for thousands of years. Meat, fish, eggs, vegetables, berries, nuts, yogurt, olive oil, even beer, wine and whole-grain bread from time to time. On the other hand, all the foods I gave up were only created over the past century. I'm talking all the hydrogenated vegetable oils and the high fructose corn syrups and all those other artificial flavors and additives that are thrown into our (processed) food these days.

[SamAdams76]

I’ve worked in the field for over 30 years and I have not yet found a low carb high protein diet that works because just as soon as you go off it, you gain it back.

Think about what you just said! No matter what kind of diet you are on, you are going to gain the weight back as soon as you go back to your old way of eating! Major DUH! The key to successful weight loss is to make a permanent lifestyle change. Any effort to lose weight through a temporary change in diet and exercise is doomed to failure.

[SamAdams76]

One point I forgot to make in my previous post comparing low-carb to low-fat diets is that a low-carb diet done properly result in no hunger.

All my efforts to lose weight on the traditional low-fat diets resulted in disaster because I just could not deal with the constant hunger pangs. Okay, call me undisciplined or lacking in willpower, but the bottom line was, I couldn't stick on a low-fat diet. Sooner or later, I'd break down and pig out in a major way, immediately reversing any weight loss (and usually adding to it).

With this low-carb (I prefer to call it normal-carb) diet, the first thing I noticed was that I no longer had to snack between meals because I just didn't get hungry. For breakfast, I'll have a couple of eggs and a cup of blueberry yogurt and that tides me over to lunch with no problem. In the past, I could eat a stack of pancakes or two large bowls of cereal for breakfast and by mid-morning, I'd be starving again so I'd get a pastry or a donut or a couple of bagels. Then I'd be ravenous for lunch!

I'm amazed at how little I eat for breakfast and lunch (my usual lunch is a tin of sardines) and yet I make it to supper with no need to snack whatsoever. The few times that I do snack, I am content with a handful of nuts or a hunk of cheese.

So this is a way of eating I have no trouble sticking with because I don't have those constant hunger pangs anymore.

[Finalapproach29er]

I'll keep Breyers in mind next time I go shopping. Thanks for the tip.

Now about low-carb bread.......................

[Nov3]

I have done a cursory search on his institute. They are big advocates of vigorous aerobic exercise and a low fat (~15%) diet. It is obviously something that will work if you WILL exercise strenuously and like that kind of food. I won't exercise strenuously and don't like low fat food. I am sure he is in great shape. On the other hand I just won't go to the gym (though I should) and just walk a couple of miles a day (at a military pace though). I should be doing 10,000 steps like you quoted earlier and indeed I even saw this quoted in the institute literature. I can respect his plan.

What I don't respect is his coming into this thread with a bunch of discredited research. Unfortunately I don't have the time and inclination to discredit his copy and paste post. I wish Dana113 or 1114 or whatever her name was was still posting. She had a veritable trove of information with links ready to post on the issue. I just read and eat this way. I stay about 100 grams and weight is never an issue.

Congratulation on the weight loss. It is one of the fastest and most impressive I have seen. My wife is at lowcarbfriends.com and there are a lot of other success stories similar to yours and mine. These are people who bought into the lowfat thing (I did 8 years ago!) and thought they didn't have willpower. I know you have never opened a huge bag of chips for a few and found yourself finishing it a few minutes later. I however have. I went on this diet, got into ketosis, and the cravings disappeared immediately. Suddenly I had "willpower". I have extreme "willpower" on other issues - just ask my wife! However give me a box of special K cereal and I will empty it and look for more! A baked potato! I eat one and I am hungry a half hour later. A big serving of rice, the same thing. I seem to be able to eat small servings of rice and not be bothered however.

The truth about the trash that is given out as food in our culture is coming out. I am sure Redwood doesn't eat trash but I still would not be able to handle the 250+ grams of carbs he is eating and not gain weight or constantly be hungry.

[Teacher317]

Just had a sandwich for lunch... on BlackBROWNberry Multi-grain bread.
Good stuff.