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Friedman: The End of the West?
The New York Times ^
| 11/02/03
| THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN
Posted on 11/01/2003 3:05:01 PM PST by Pokey78
Well, the numbers are in and the numbers don't lie. At the Madrid aid conference, Saudi Arabia pledged $1 billion in new loans and credits for Iraq and Germany and France pledged 0 new dollars. Add it all up and the bottom line becomes clear: Saudi Arabia actually cares more about nurturing democracy in Iraq than Germany and France.
Ah, you say, but that's unfair. Germany and France opposed the war, so why should they pay anything more than their share of the paltry E.U. contribution? Actually, it's not unfair, when you remember that before the war France and Germany were obsessed with the lifting of U.N. sanctions on Saddam's regime in the name of easing the suffering of the Iraqi people.
Well, the U.S. has removed the whole Saddam regime, which was the real source of suffering for the Iraqi people, and yet that seems to be worth nothing to Germany and France. So there we have it: Pretending to ease the suffering of the Iraqi people by calling for the removal of sanctions but keeping Saddam in power so he can buy lots of stuff from Germany and France is priceless to them. But easing the suffering of the Iraqi people by removing Saddam's whole sick regime is worthless to them.
Ah, you say, but that's unfair. The leaders of France and Germany have a principled position. They honestly believe that democracy is not possible in Iraq or anywhere in the Arab world and trying to deliver it will just make things worse. Now, that's an honest argument worthy of debate. But they never say that out loud they simply complain at the U.N. that America has not transferred sovereignty to the Iraqi people more quickly. If their real concern was empowering Iraqis to run their own lives, wouldn't they be in there helping Iraqis get their act together faster?
What I'm getting at here is that when you find yourself in an argument with Europeans over Iraq, they try to present it as if we both want the same thing, but we just have different approaches. And had the Bush team not been so dishonest and unilateral, we could have worked together. I wish the Bush team had behaved differently, but that would not have been a cure-all because if you look under the European position you see we have two different visions, not just tactical differences. Many Europeans really do believe that a dominant America is more threatening to global stability than Saddam's tyranny.
The more I hear this, the more I wonder whether we are witnessing something much larger than a passing storm over Iraq. Are we witnessing the beginning of the end of "the West" as we have known it a coalition of U.S.-led, like-minded allies, bound by core shared values and strategic threats?
I am not alone in thinking this. Carl Bildt, the former Swedish prime minister, noted to me in Brussels the other day that for a generation Americans and Europeans shared the same date: 1945. A whole trans-Atlantic alliance flowed from that postwar shared commitment to democratic government, free markets and the necessity of deterring the Soviet Union. America saw the strength of Europe as part of its own front line and vice versa and this bond "made the resolution of all other issues both necessary and possible," said Mr. Bildt.
Today, however, we are motivated by different dates. "Our defining date is now 1989 and yours is 2001," said Mr. Bildt. Every European prime minister wakes up in the morning thinking about how to share sovereignty, as Europe takes advantage of the collapse of communism to consolidate economically, politically and militarily into one big family. And the U.S. president wakes up thinking about where the next terror attack might come from and how to respond most likely alone. "While we talk of peace, they talk of security," says Mr. Bildt. "While we talk of sharing sovereignty, they talk about exercising sovereign power. When we talk about a region, they talk about the world. No longer united primarily by a common threat, we have also failed to develop a common vision for where we want to go on many of the global issues confronting us."
Just as we once had U.S.-Soviet summits to ease the tensions of the cold war, maybe it's time for a U.S.-French-German summit to ease the tensions of the post-cold war. Leaders of all three nations have behaved badly and have weakened the West, even if they have not ended it. It's time to chart a new Atlantic alliance, but not one that is based on nostalgia for 1945 one that really bridges the differences between 1989 and 2001.
TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Germany; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: deathofthewest; thewest; thomasfriedman; thomaslfriedman
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1
posted on
11/01/2003 3:05:02 PM PST
by
Pokey78
To: Pokey78
It will take a 9-11 on European soil to get their attention. They would blame it on us though. We stirred up the hornets nest aftr all./sarcasm.
2
posted on
11/01/2003 3:09:51 PM PST
by
Arkie2
To: Pokey78
America saw the strength of Europe as part of its own front line and vice versa.I think he overstates our regard for European strength in the cold war. And Friedman is too quick to confuse moral squalor of Old Europe with the more vibrant nations of New Europe that are helping us in Iraq. But overall I agree with his thesis.
3
posted on
11/01/2003 3:12:46 PM PST
by
68skylark
To: Pokey78
I think his name was spelled incorrectly. Isn't it Mr. Bilge?
4
posted on
11/01/2003 3:13:31 PM PST
by
doug from upland
(Why aren't the Clintons living out their remaining years on Alcatraz?)
To: Pokey78
Marked to read later.
5
posted on
11/01/2003 3:15:25 PM PST
by
leadpenny
To: Pokey78
Leaders of all three nations have behaved badly and have weakened the West, even if they have not ended it. Whatever he might have said earlier in this article that makes sense, that tears it.
6
posted on
11/01/2003 3:17:13 PM PST
by
Cicero
(Marcus Tullius)
To: Pokey78
"[The EU] is the new European Soviet."
-- Mikhail Gorbachev, March 2000
7
posted on
11/01/2003 3:18:37 PM PST
by
polemikos
(Euro-Darwinism -- A Death Wish Since The Reformation and Enlightenment)
To: Pokey78
Europe is a collection of lovely little museum countries.
Bear in mind when planning your visit that they're closed Mondays.
8
posted on
11/01/2003 3:19:47 PM PST
by
billorites
(freepo ergo sum)
To: Arkie2
It will take a 9-11 on European soil to get their attention.France and Germany and the vast majority of the rest of the world wants nothing to do with our occupational war and attempts at installing an American puppet regieme in Iraq. You can't blame them as our adventure will undoubtedly fail miserably and at much additional cost. Every year it will be more money down the rat hole and more lives lost in a misguided attempt to consumerize the Iraqi people.
Richard W.
9
posted on
11/01/2003 3:23:53 PM PST
by
arete
(Greenspan is a ruling class elitist and closet socialist who is destroying the economy)
To: arete
Would you be upset if we succeed?
To: Pokey78
The up and coming apparatchiks with the EU devotion have forgotten that their own grandfathers and great-grandfathers did their best to destroy Europe.
Had not America contributed millions of lives to save Europe from iteself, a new dark age would have consumed this new, smug generation in the womb or before.
Now they do not care. EUnichs mock our Christian, cowboy President from Texas. They are quick to mock Americans as being "independent".
EUnichs may fancy that French will again become the Lingua, but they gravely risk that tongue being Lingua Arabia.
Looks like hair in the sink. Sounds like hair in the throat, before it is slit.
Euopeans will find themselves in Eurabia, either groveling towards Mecca five times a day tangled in head coverings and carpets or dead.
The first on the psychopath's, may piece be upon him, koran's kill list, before even the spawn of pigs and monkeys Jew, is peaceful and apostate muslims. Aloof, post-modern Europeans will not make good muslims, so they will be replaced by the busy wahhabees and their henchmen jihadies, just as was the plan before the Battle of Tours.
By attacking America in this Terror War of annihilation, jihadies knew that Euopre was not like America. Europeans would not come to the aid of a bloodied America, but would sit and mock her defense.
Oily jihadies may not have underestimated American fascist leadership such as the Clintons' DNC-Politburo, but they most certainly underestimated Americans. I think that the jihadies got the Europeans about right.
11
posted on
11/01/2003 3:29:13 PM PST
by
SevenDaysInMay
(Federal judges and justices serve for periods of good behavior, not life. Article III sec. 1)
To: arete
Well, that's probably what you hope will happen but it's not going to end that way. Hope it doesn't upset you too much when we accomplish our goals there.
12
posted on
11/01/2003 3:30:55 PM PST
by
Arkie2
To: Batrachian
Would you be upset if we succeed?No, but then again I still believe in Santa Claus.
Richard W.
13
posted on
11/01/2003 3:34:05 PM PST
by
arete
(Greenspan is a ruling class elitist and closet socialist who is destroying the economy)
To: Pokey78
Many Europeans really do believe that a dominant America is more threatening to global stability than Saddam's tyranny. Well, we ARE the greatest threat to "stability." For them, stability is when things -- no matter how awful -- don't change. Well, we're going to change things if we must.
14
posted on
11/01/2003 3:35:31 PM PST
by
wizardoz
(Palestinians are just dynamite!)
To: billorites
Europe is a collection of lovely little museum countries. Bear in mind when planning your visit that they're closed Mondays.And those in charge of cleaning the bathrooms are evidently union workers.
15
posted on
11/01/2003 3:41:00 PM PST
by
wizardoz
(Palestinians are just dynamite!)
To: arete
LOL! Do you do open-mike night down at the American Legion?
16
posted on
11/01/2003 3:42:55 PM PST
by
wizardoz
(Palestinians are just dynamite!)
To: Pokey78
No, no and no. We don't need a U.S-Europe summit. Once Europe was the fulcrum of the world but today it can hardly lift its shriveled muscle. All it does is whine at the U.S about its impotence as well it should. I'd recommend that Tom Friedman start reading Robert Kagan's The Paradise And Power for a succinct but through discussion of why America and Europe appear to be travelling on different paths. An Al Gore Administration would have muted the rift for awhile but the reality is we're just too strong to want to act like a weak country. We don't need to. In short, we don't owe the Europeans a damn thing and they owe us everything for the last half century in which American power kept them from falling into the Soviet orbit. Something to think about.
17
posted on
11/01/2003 3:43:35 PM PST
by
goldstategop
(In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
To: Pokey78
"Leaders of all three nations have behaved badly and have weakened the West"
No they haven't. The leaders of France and Germany have behaved badly. In contrast, GW has gone out of his way to be polite to them, all while remaining firm in his committment to American security.
To: SevenDaysInMay
Bump
19
posted on
11/01/2003 3:51:39 PM PST
by
GopherIt
To: arete
Part of me is shocked by your attitude. But another part of me is genuinely interested to know why you feel that way. Are the Iraqis incapable of living their lives with more freedom, democracy and liberty? Or is there some other factor that dooms our efforts to failure?
I take the opposite view. I agree with whoever said its the manifest destiny of the United States to help spread liberty and prosperity to the rest of the world. Thats not to say it will always be easy or that every battle will be successful that wont happen. But as a taxpayer this is one of the few things that Im happy to help pay for. And as a soldier its something Ill fight for.
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