Done any tanking? Get on this list.
Posted on 10/29/2003 3:06:38 AM PST by konijn
Done any tanking? Get on this list.
Next thing you know, the Leftist Media will be calling them freedom fighters!
Yep, looks like a sabot round to me too, although the portions that hit the gunner's flak jacket and the stuff that went through the safety guard appear to be spalling.
I'd like to see what was left of the projectile. Have you heard of any analysis on what was left of it?
I'd like to see what was left of the projectile. Have you heard of any analysis on what was left of it?
I too think it looks more lokely to be a KE munition than a HEAT warhead like that of an *AT-4 Spigot* [9K111-2 Fagot-M] or anything similar, short of possibly a 9M123-2 Hrizantema Krizantema, which flies at supersonic speed and is said to be able to defeat a full meter of composite armor from 6KM. Scary.
The Fagot -M has a range of out to 2.5 KM and is said to be able to penetrate almost 500mm- half a meter, a bit less than 20 inches of steel armor. I don't know how that'd translate so far as the DU armor of the upgraded Abrams, but there've been either very few reported M1A2 kills by presently fielded SovBloc ATGMs, so I'd bet on either something else entirely or a much-improved next generation missile sharing the same launcher mechanism.
Note, though, that there's no sighn of a heat round's scorch marks or dribbled slag at the point of impact. I suspect a hard penetrator moving at 4500 FPS+, though possibly a self-forged slug shaped and driven bu a shaped charge blast in flight, as several of the *smart* AT artillery munitions function from above.
I've got a couple of e-mails out to pals at the Ft Knox college of tanker knowledge, and pointed them to this thread. Maybe we'll get some feedback, maybe not. But we might pick up a couple more treadhead FReepers, and I'd settle for that.
The attack occurred at about 10:15 a.m. (4:15 a.m. EDT) Wednesday, five hours after the United States vetoed a U.N. Security Council resolution that would have condemned Israel for building a controversial fence around the West Bank, and as Israeli soldiers in the southern Gaza Strip continued a six-day-old operation to destroy cross-border tunnels. Eight Palestinians have been killed and more than 230 homes have been destroyed or severely damaged in that operation.
The bomb detonated as the convoy was about 11/2 miles inside the Gaza Strip from the Erez crossing at the Israeli border. They were driving along the pockmarked, partially blacktopped road that runs the length of the Gaza Strip and is frequently used by foreigners -- diplomats, aid workers, journalists and others -- as well as by local Palestinians.
According to witnesses and U.S. Embassy officials, a Palestinian security team led the convoy in one car, the American security guards occupied the second vehicle, at least two U.S. diplomats were in the third, and another Palestinian police car brought up the rear. * * *
U.S. officials said the vehicle had armor plating on its roof and sides, but said they did not know whether the vehicle was equipped with armor on its underside to protect against land mines. Israeli officials estimated that the bomb, which was buried in the hardpan roadbed, might have weighed more than 100 pounds.
A smaller bomb planted on another road in the northern Gaza Strip exploded under an Israeli military all-terrain vehicle Wednesday morning, injuring three soldiers, according to an Israeli military spokesman. The spokesman said the two incidents were not believed to be related.
Homemade bombs concocted from petroleum products, sugar, cosmetics, shampoo and varying amounts of TNT are commonly used by militants in the Gaza Strip. The explosives are frequently planted in potholes or beneath roadbeds on routes used by Israeli military vehicles and have been used to blow up 50-ton tanks as well as lighter vehicles.
Some of the explosives are detonated on impact when a vehicle rolls over them; others are more sophisticated and are set off by remote control. A gray cable hanging into the crater left by Wednesday's attack on the U.S. vehicle suggested that the bomb might have been ignited by remote control from a nearby concrete hut. This is pure speculation, but I think these two sets of tactics are pretty similar. The U.S. suspects right now that foreign elements are behind many of the attacks in Iraq, and that they are having a significant influence on domestic Iraqi guerillas. Even if they're not actually conducting the attacks, I think it's very likely these foreigners are providing training and expertise to the Iraqis in the art of urban combat and insurgency. To some extent, these foreign guerillas may also be passing along their doctrine from places like the Gaza Strip and West Bank, where guerillas and terrorists have learned how to defeat sophisticated Israeli security schemes and achieve deadly results. This is a very dangerous development.
The key is to get the transition to a sustainable point and get the uniformed troops the hell out of sight ASAP.
Yep. Don't get sidetracked. Get to the point where we need to be and then reduce our footprint. It's really about all you can do.
Said wisely from 10,000 miles away at a keyboard.....LOL.
Unfortunately not, it was completely destroyed...turret blown off and landing nearby.
You've seen the pictures here
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