Gadget Prevents Plane Seats From Reclining

AP via Excite News ^ | Oct 24, 2:00 PM (ET) | BRAD FOSS

[leadpencil1]

WASHINGTON (AP) - Every cramped air traveler may have the right to lean his seat back, but Ira Goldman sees airplane justice from another perspective - that of the person behind - and he's found a way to even the score.

Goldman invented the Knee Defender, a beeper-sized block of plastic that lets passengers prevent the seat in front of them from reclining.

The gadget, which went on sale about a month ago on the Internet for $10, has sparked heated debate in online chat rooms, and aviation officials worry about the disagreements that will be generated at 30,000 feet.

Alison Duquette, a spokeswoman for the Federal Aviation Administration, said the product violates no FAA regulations, so it would be up to individual airlines to prohibit it.

Northwest Airlines (NWB) said it will ban the Knee Defender from all flights. Other carriers, such as American Airlines and Delta Air Lines, acknowledged concerns about safety - not to mention the comfort of passengers who want to recline - but are still figuring out what to do.

The safety concerns stem from the design, because the Knee Defender works only when the tray table is down. The hard plastic block, which has an inch-wide groove down the middle, fits around the arm of a tray table and acts as a barrier to the seat's backward movement.

"We have tested this product on several seat types and find that when installed, should someone try to force the seat to recline, the tray table assembly can break," said Mary Stanik, a Northwest spokeswoman. "If the seat is damaged, including the tray table, in flight, it may adversely affect passenger evacuation in the event of an emergency."

Goldman said he would stop selling the product if the airlines prove it unsafe, but so far he's unmoved by their arguments. The 50-year-old Washington, D.C., resident, who's 6-foot-4, said he didn't invent Knee Defender so fliers would be able to "hog scarce space," but rather for the physical well-being of tall travelers like himself.

"If I hadn't been bashed in the knees over and over again, this wouldn't have been invented," said Goldman, who estimated that nearly 1,000 Knee Defenders have been ordered. At the very least, he said the device could be a useful "early warning system" for long-legged fliers or people using laptops, enabling them to ask the passenger in front not to recline.

"Be polite to fellow passengers," says a sticker affixed to each Knee Defender.

Kevin Gross of San Francisco, who ordered a Knee Defender but hasn't yet used it, said he would immediately remove the device if asked to by a passenger or flight attendant. But Gross is betting it'll go undetected in most cases, since travelers will just assume the seat is busted and not make a fuss.

Don't count on 50-year-old Dan Hammer of White Plains, N.Y., to be so docile.

"If I saw somebody that put the Knee Defender on the seat behind me so that I can't go back, I'll be very upset," Hammer said.

That's just the kind of high dudgeon that worries Dawn Deeks, a spokeswoman for the Association of Flight Attendants.

After all, flight attendants already often ask passengers not to lean back too far, and they would be the ones to police any disputes.

To Deeks, the Knee Defender is "an insensitive knee-jerk reaction to insensitive people" that would only inflame tempers.

[Malsua]

Personally, I'm so annoyed by passengers reclining in front of me (I'm also tall) that I absolutely never recline my own seat. That 5 degrees of relining does almost no good whatever, in any case. Man, you said it. I NEVER recline my seat more than a tiny tiny bit unless I'm flying to Asia and I'm in Business. More often than not, the people that tend to recline their seats are smaller females. I think this is because the top of the seat is tilted forward slightly and it pushes their head forward so they recline to compensate. For me, I just cock my head to the side and try to deal best I can but invariably the person in front reclines and leaves me with no legroom and enough space on the tray for some peanuts. If no one is behind me, then I'll recline but it still isn't very much more comfy.

[Proud_texan]

"Ask first."

What a refreshing idea. I'm pretty tall, no 6'7" but at 6'4" just to the point where if the person that reclines bounces around a bit it's uncomfortable and if they really get going it hurts. I've always had a fantasy to let out a loud holler, grab my knee and roll in the aisle writhing in pain.

But I have had a few people, a very few, actually ask if I minded. I was impressed and told 'em sure, I'd was willing to be uncomfortable just because it was refreshing to run into a polite person.

Unrestrained recliners are like those folks that go to the movies and yak through the whole thing bothering everybody around them, but hey, they're entitled, after all they bought a ticket, screw everybody else.

An ex-flyer that never, ever reclined.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

The airlines ought to just remove all the seats and put in poles to hang on to.

They would undoubtedly put the poles at about six feet like they do on buses.

I wouldn't mind standing for the flight but you and I would have to either stand on tip-toe or hang on to a fellow passenger.

[ravinson]

At 6'7", I have and use my very own built in "Knee Defender" and have many a good story to tell. Once someone tries to recline their seat and can't (because my knees are holding it upright), they never try again for the rest of the flight.

Fat people and "too talls" like you should be required to pay for two seats on a flight.

[leadpencil1]

Fat people and "too talls" like you should be required to pay for two seats on a flight

Maybe I can put my luggage on your head and you can follow me around the airport as my luggage cart; then I wouldn't have to pay for the cart and could afford to pay for two seats.

[leadpencil1]

An ex-flyer that never, ever reclined.

Same here.

[k omalley]

On the way back from Rome the not so tiny lady in front of me not once but twice bounced on the seat as hard as she could while pushing her recline button. I hollered with the excruciating pain I felt in my knee. I got no reaction from her either time. People are either rude or oblivious, I'm not sure which.

[Beck_isright]

I'm with you. At 6'4 I don't know how many times I wished I had this device. And I wish they would allow flight attendents to carry mace to shut up brats who cry the entire flight and annoy other passengers becuase of bad parenting. Then again, I've cut my flying back to maybe once per year because of all of the aggravations listed above. If I can drive there, I will.

[ravinson]

Maybe I can put my luggage on your head and you can follow me around the airport as my luggage cart; then I wouldn't have to pay for the cart and could afford to pay for two seats.

I think I hit a nerve. You must be tall and fat.

[leadpencil1]

I think I hit a nerve. You must be tall and fat.

Just having fun, Napoleon.

[max_rpf]

ROFLMAO -- I hope this thread doesn't get pulled -- You are on a roll tonight!

[Lazamataz]

This is what's causing all the ruckus around here:

What, the Tic Tacs?

[ChemistCat]

Yes, it would be challenging, wouldn't it!

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

Maybe leadpencil1 would let us hang on to him.

[glorgau]

Fat people and "too talls" like you should be required to pay for two seats on a flight.

I agree most heartily. Anything else is Karl Marx' "From each according to his abilty, to each according to his need".

[weegee]

"We have tested this product on several seat types and find that when installed, should someone try to force the seat to recline, the tray table assembly can break," said Mary Stanik, a Northwest spokeswoman. "If the seat is damaged, including the tray table, in flight, it may adversely affect passenger evacuation in the event of an emergency."

I'd like to see the airlines bill the customers who put these on seats if they are causing damage to the equipment. The passenger who paid for a seat and is unable to lean it back is not accountable for the damage. He paid for a seat and it was sabotaged by another passenger. Bill the saboteur.

[weegee]

If we are going to bill wideload passengers for 2 seats we might as well bill the extra tall passengers who don't want someone in front of them reclining for 2 seats as well (we'll just leave that seat empty).

[Proud_texan]

I never figured out what good reclining did, sort of useless the way the airlines pack you in. Maybe if I was shorter I'd get it.

Not that it was ever easy but I always got a kick out of trying to use a laptop when the seat in front was reclined and the tray table was pushed in my sternum.

[Proud_texan]

Aw, you shoulda tried rolling in the aisle screaming that your patella have been ripped off and demanded the plane be deverted for immediate medical attention. So what the rest of the passengers are put out, after all, you're more important than they are (nah, only kidding, I can tell you wouldn't do that).

I don't know if it's rudeness or entitlement.

Like the yuck that talks through the movie. Last time I went to a movie I must have changed seats four times. Yep, I asked politely each time if they could keep their voice down. I got a weird stare a couple of times with a "what's your problem?" and a f' off the other two.

Swore off movies just like I have flying.

Generally I have a pretty high opinion of people, but you get a bunch of 'em in a tight place and you're gonna run into that 5%....

[anka]

that and the bulkhead seats...
like first class but without the champagne