Operation Barbarossa: The Failure of Nazi Ideology at the Eastern Front

The Student Historical Journal 1989-1990 ^ | Paul Fleming, Jr.

[SAMWolf]

You're correct.

A lot of the Wehrmacht Officer Corps opposed the Nazi actions but they also were partly responsible for Hitler's rise to power. Once the Nazi's were in charge, it was hard for them to even speak out against the Nazi's much less outright oppose them. Retaliation against oppsotion was swift and brutal.

[SAMWolf]

Yes, but Stalin was killing his own people. I was trying to point out that Stalin was butchering his own people on a large scale to keep himself and the Communists in power.

[RussianConservative]

True, but key difference: Stalin kill for politics, Hitler kill for race and politics...so not even if one keep head down can one live if great great grandfather wrong race.

[SAMWolf]

I'm not trying to diminish what Hitler and the Nazi's did, just wanted to show that Stalin wasn't much better and I have no doubt that if Stalin had conquered the countries Hitler did, he would have also perpetrated mass murder on the populations.

[Sparta]

The German Imperial Army though failed to march on Moscow and secure the entire nation. Also, they were helped by two revolutions and the appeasnik policies of Lenin and Trotsky.

[weikel]

The German Imperial army had finished the Russians. A peace similar to Brest-Litosky would have eventually been signed by the Provisional government though it may have taken another year.

True it would be unfeasible for the German Imperial army to take all Russia but Russian morale was gone. Too many charges with sticks against German machine guns with no success wore down their morale.

Germany had basically won in the West too. Unfortunately Wilson intervened and as a result the greatest civilization on the European continent since the Roman Empire was defeated and Versailles was imposed. The commies were left in power with a nullified Brest Litosk treaty. The Weimar state was almost guaranteed to be a wreck and Hitler's rise became possible, the Arabs and all sorts of other turd world states got independence from their more efficient colonial rulers as a result of the self determination precedent.

America fought WWI on the wrong side. The world would be harmoniously divided up between Britain( yes I think the British empire would have done better if the Kaiser won), America, and the United States if Germany won. Wer'd also be much farther ahead technologically.

[delta7]

Some of the most evil people ever spawned.
———————-
The Russians I hope you refer to. My mother’s story, not in line with much of history.
She was born in Lithuania, 1932, she is still living. The Russian German pact prior to the war gave half Lithuania to the Soviets....hundreds of thousands were disappearing, sent to Soviet Gulags... she stayed up nights watching for the Soviet secret police to come to her farm.....when suddenly one day the German Army pulled up to her farm, they took half of their livestock and paid them in money....they were the “ Saviors”,flash forward to 1944 when the advanced Soviets rolled up- they stayed in the barn, raping, then hung 3 nuns by their necks from the rafters....her family left ( fled) the next morning, ended up in Dresden in February, survived the bombings, ended up in an Austrian Refugee camp, then made their way to America in 1946. The Soviets were far, far worse than the Germans.....argue away, but I went back with her in 1993 when the Soviets pulled out of Lithuania and the hatred for the Soviets was still there.

[delta7]

I’m not trying to diminish what Hitler and the Nazi’s did, just wanted to show that Stalin wasn’t much better and I have no doubt that if Stalin had conquered the countries Hitler did, he would have also perpetrated mass murder on the populations.
————-
50 percent of Lithuania was deported to Siberia by Stalin and the communists. Reference my post above- my mother’s story.....Stalin was far, far worse than Hitler, at least in the Baltic countries.

[snippy_about_it]

My comment was on the list Phil had posted, Pol Pot, Stalin, etc. We have a similar story. My husband’s mother born in Germany in 1930, bombed out of Cologne, my husband’s father born in Warsaw in 1927, fought as a teenager in the Warsaw uprising of 44 and like the other survivors, taken prisoner, freed by the British. Recruited by the Americans to patrol the American sector of Germany, met my mother-in-law and emigrated to the USA in 1949. Lots of horror stories they can also tell of the Russians.

Thank you for sharing your story.

[snippy_about_it]

True. Thanks.