The Hobbit Hole III - Journey to the Cross-roads!

[HairOfTheDog]

Welcome to The Hobbit Hole!

Journey to the Cross-roads
The Two Towers Edition

Come on! Come in! -if you would like to have some seedcakes and a pint and relax a while. (If it is a special occasion, we still have a few bottles of the old wineyards left!)

Our first thread ( New Zealander builds Hobbit hole ) reached 4,100 posts, and we thought that was big. Our second thread (The New Hobbit Hole ) held us for over 48,000 posts, and we loved it dearly. We talked about moving to a new thread for the last 38,000 posts, but we are really slow to muster! Finally, the time has come. Tomorrow (at 12:01 am, to be precise!) The Two Towers comes out, and we start a new chapter.

[carton253]

What a difference two opinions make, eh?

Just as you read my opinion regarding Faramir and your jaw dropped, so does mine when I read your opinion about Boromir.

Yes, Boromir was raised to be Steward of Gondor. He was raised to be responsible for the welfare of the its citizens. A heavy duty. He hasn't been practicing identifying himself with Gondor, he does identify himself with Gondor. This is a good thing. This means that he takes his duty seriously.

I don't see the fault in this. I can tell you do because you have all of Middle Earth careening toward disaster because Boromir is the heir. Wow! Like I said, what a difference in two opinions.

Boromir comes to Rivendell after (I know I don't have the places right) battling the Nazgul in Ilithein (sorry). He has a dream, and he comes to find out the meaning. Nothing sinister there. In fact, if memory serves me, doesn't Faramir play a role in the dream. I want to say Faramir has the dream, but Boromir comes? The books are too long removed for me to remember.

He sees in the ring a great weapon. For what? For Boromir the glory hound? No, for Gondor. Like I said, he is responsible for the city, and the city is fading, no longer able to withstand the threat it finds itself under.

Everyone gets so severe with Boromir because he wants the ring... and everyone applauds Faramir because he is able to withstand the ring. Well, goody for Faramir... but, as you stated "the ring after tempting everyone in one way or another."

Tolkien has created this weapon... this one ring... this overwhelming thing of evil. It takes ahold of Ilsidur (sp), Smeagol, Bilbo, Frodo, and even Sam during his short possession of it. This ring is so awesome that Gandalf knows that if he has it, it will corrupt him.

This ring is consistent... and we know what it will do. We understand the implications of the ring, yet, Boromir, who does not throughout the book (even though he is warned... he doesn't believe it). Yes, he is tempted. Poor, human Boromir. Yes, he makes a play for it... Poor, human Boromir. But, he recovers himself. And for that, his is called a glory hound and his responsibility to Gondor is called into question! LOL!

Faramir, on the other hand, isn't tempted in the least. No, he wouldn't even pick up the ring if he saw it on the road. What a betrayal of the ring by Tolkien. If Faramir is the most like Tolkien, then what does that say about Tolkien's opinion of himself. That he is beyond reproach!

I think most of us would like to be Faramir... but in reality are more like Boromir.

Your other points abour Faramir are valid.

What I don't like about Faramir is he is too good to begin with, never changes throughout the course of the book, is one-dimensional and is constantly thrust upon us, and even his romance with bland Eowyn is one-dimensional and boring!

Ultimately, that is Faramir's crime. He bores me. For that crime, he can't recover.

[2Jedismom]

Good morning! Fixin' to be a big storm sweeping through here, so I may not stay online...

http://www.srh.noaa.gov/radar/latest/DS.p19r0/si.kinx.shtml

How was your weekeneds? Mine was busy and fun...went to a program put on by Matthew and Joshua's VBS and then lunch on the grounds.

We were going to pick some farm raised blackberries today, but now it's looking pretty unlikely.

[Sam Cree]

Morning Carton, Lil'freeper, Overtaxed, All.

[Sam Cree]

Morning 2J.

[2Jedismom]

Good morning!

[2Jedismom]

I should get off line...the weather is pretty grim with some loud claps of thunder. See you all later!

[carton253]

Good morning!

[Sam Cree]

See you later, then.

[Overtaxed]

Good Morning!

We're expecting Bill here around Wednesday.

[Lil'freeper]

they took my printer, my samples didn't run, the hoods aren't working

Ack! Bummer!

[Lil'freeper]

Be safe!

[Sam Cree]

OK, I went back and read your post. Now, I'll have to find 300winmag's and read it, too.

It's true, Tolkien is on record as saying that no one would have had the power to resist the ring.

However, I do see Borimir as something of a glory hound, not because of deeds in the book, that's just how I think JRRT drew him. And, at the Council of Elrond, he was downright rude to Aragorn, more so in the book than the movie, if I remember. However, I think Peter Jackson painted a much more sympathetic Borirmir than JRRT did.

I didn't see the book Faramir as boring, but I bet you Peter Jackson did, that could explain the change in Faramir's attitude for the movie.

Eowyn as bland? That adjective doesn't fit any of the characters, IMO.

[Overtaxed]

Think I'll just breathe fumes and start anyway. They're threatening to take the instrument.

[Lil'freeper]

Who is "they"? Are they Nazgul? Trolls? Orcses? Gobblins? Brownies?

[Overtaxed]

The people in charge of shutting down the lab.

[carton253]

I don't blame Boromir for his rudeness to Aragorn. Aragorn is king of Gondor... Gondor is fighting for her life, and her king is off being a ranger.

Yes, there were reasons for Aragorn's doing what he was doing... but Boromir doesn't know what they are when he arrives in Rivendell. Just because the reader does, does not mean we can project them on Boromir. Boromir is living up to his responsibility. To Boromir, Aragorn is not. If I was in Boromir's position, I would have some sharp words for Aragron also.

What makes Faramir boring to me is that his character is defined when we meet him, and he doesn't change. That is admirable. Forget the fact that the ring looses its inate quality to tempt around Faramir... Faramir stays consistent throughout the book. To me, that is boring, because I like the struggle... I like to see my characters battle what we all struggle with. There is none of that in Faramir. There is none of that in Eowyn either.

She's sad, she rides out to war, she's sad. She is wounded, she is sad. She meets Faramir, falls in love in a few short paragraphs and lives happily ever after. Personally, I don't think happy is in Eowyn... But I understand her sadness. She has not had a happy life. Yet, Tolkien only draws her in shades of sad.

The movie Eowyn is alot better portrayed. She actually smiles...

[300winmag]

The consequences of washing Puff in the kitchen sink:

[Sam Cree]

Your cat has funny eyes, OT.

[Overtaxed]

Heh...that's not my cat. My kitty is black and the last time I gave her a bath I had to chase soapy cat around the bathroom.

[carton253]

Mine just caterwaul as if I was filleting them very slowly.

Once a year they get bathed.

Oh the racket they make!!!!