[Vaquero]

Then there is the whole Donner Party kerfuffle.

[blackdog]

A good rule of thumb is to never find yourself above 8’000 feet in the winter. The temperature drops three degrees for every 1000’ above sea level. So a 35 degree day in the valleys will be approximately zero degrees at 8000’.

[blackdog]

"Then there is the whole Donner Party kerfuffle."

That's a problem with a completely different flavor.