Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article


1 posted on 08/01/2022 9:00:05 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-37 next last
To: PeaRidge; wardaddy; jeffersondem; Ohioan; woodpusher; rustbucket

Ping.


2 posted on 08/01/2022 9:01:47 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

EXACTLY
Atlas Shrugged, Animal Farm & 1984 were supposed to be prophetic WARNINGS, not instruction manuals.


3 posted on 08/01/2022 9:03:31 AM PDT by Conservative4Life (thy merchants were great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived. Rev18:23)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp
Ayn said nothing about the Civil War.

As I recall, senators were equally appropriated between North and South states, with the Southern states all slaving states. In fact, new state admissions had to be split between free and slave, to keep this symmetry.

However, the South had a perverse advantage over all free states in representation, because they got 3/5ths benefit from every slave they could create (breed) or import in, while the North wasn't benefiting from that.

I think the OP is blind to the truth, because he's proven he's blind to what Ayn said “about the Civil War.”

5 posted on 08/01/2022 9:06:07 AM PDT by ConservativeMind (Trump: Befuddling Democrats, Republicans, and the Media for the benefit of the US and all mankind.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

And that was before the Federal Income Tax and the IRS.
And before the Federal Reserve Act.
….
So duties and tariffs and taxes on liquor were most of the revenue?


6 posted on 08/01/2022 9:07:17 AM PDT by Honest Nigerian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

It was called the correct term “war of Northern Aggression”. The South rightfully wanted to secede. If your daughter or son wanted to leave the house and venture out, why stop them?


7 posted on 08/01/2022 9:09:47 AM PDT by max americana (Fired leftards at work since 2008 at every election just to see them cry. I hate them all.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

Read this excerpt of Thomas Jefferson’s thoughts on slavery:

“The bill on the subject of slaves was a mere digest of the existing laws respecting them, without any intimation of a plan for a future & general emancipation. It was thought better that this should be kept back, and attempted only by way of amendment whenever the bill should be brought on. The principles of the amendment however were agreed on, that is to say, the freedom of all born after a certain day, and deportation at a proper age. But it was found that the public mind would not yet bear the proposition, nor will it bear it even to this day. Yet the day is not distant when it must bear and adopt it, or worse will follow. Nothing is more certainly written in the book of fate that these people are to be free. Nor is it less certain that the two races, equally free, cannot live in the same government....It is still in our power to direct the process of emancipation and deportation peaceably and in such slow degree as that the evil will wear off insensibly, and their place be pari passu filled up by free white laborers. If on the contrary it is left to force itself on, human nature must shudder at the prospect held up.

page 51
Thomas Jefferson Redivivus


9 posted on 08/01/2022 9:12:26 AM PDT by Brian Griffin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp
The Cornerstone Speech, given by the CSA Vice President, as the basis for leaving the United States and creating the new CSA Constitution, was as follows:

[I]ts foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests upon the great truth, that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery—subordination to the superior race—is his natural condition. This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth.[3]

The new Constitution has put at rest forever all the agitating questions relating to our peculiar institution—African slavery as it exists among us—the proper status of the negro in our form of civilization. This was the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution. Jefferson, in his forecast, had anticipated this, as the “rock upon which the old Union would split.” He was right. What was conjecture with him, is now a realized fact. But whether he fully comprehended the great truth upon which that rock stood and stands, may be doubted. The prevailing ideas entertained by him and most of the leading statesmen at the time of the formation of the old Constitution were, that the enslavement of the African was in violation of the laws of nature; that it was wrong in principle, socially, morally and politically. It was an evil they knew not well how to deal with; but the general opinion of the men of that day was, that, somehow or other, in the order of Providence, the institution would be evanescent and pass away. [...] Those ideas, however, were fundamentally wrong. They rested upon the assumption of the equality of races. This was an error. It was a sandy foundation, and the idea of a Government built upon it—when the “storm came and the wind blew, it fell.”[5][6]

Our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite ideas; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery, subordination to the superior race, is his natural and normal condition. This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth. This truth has been slow in the process of its development, like all other truths in the various departments of science.

May we not therefore look with confidence to the ultimate universal acknowledgement of the truths upon which our system rests? It is the first government ever instituted upon the principles in strict conformity to nature, and the ordination of Providence, in furnishing the materials of human society. Many governments have been founded upon the principle of the subordination and serfdom of certain classes of the same race; such were and are in violation of the laws of nature. Our system commits no such violation of nature's laws.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornerstone_Speech

10 posted on 08/01/2022 9:12:56 AM PDT by ConservativeMind (Trump: Befuddling Democrats, Republicans, and the Media for the benefit of the US and all mankind.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp
The timing of the war in relation to outside politic events, not to mention the very slavery-specific resolutions of secession adopted by most of the seceding states, point to slavery as the central issue.

Blankenship wasn't going to be able to undue those tariffs anyway even if he had won.

12 posted on 08/01/2022 9:15:41 AM PDT by Bruce Campbells Chin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd here we go!

What d’ya say boys, 300 pages minimum?


13 posted on 08/01/2022 9:15:51 AM PDT by FLT-bird
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

Thanks for posting


23 posted on 08/01/2022 9:19:54 AM PDT by gattaca
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

If you want to know the causes of the civil war, you just have to read the various articles of secession. They are quite open about their motives.

You can find them on the internet with just a few clicks.


24 posted on 08/01/2022 9:21:24 AM PDT by marron
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

I still see it. I view the climate alarmism re: cow farts and petroleum as useful for the throttling of those uppity conservative regions of the US. It’s just a shame that our fellow countrymen would abuse power like that.


25 posted on 08/01/2022 9:22:19 AM PDT by Churchjack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp
"The real causes of dissatisfaction in the South with the North, are in the unjust taxation and expenditure of the taxes by the Government of the United States, and in the revolution the North has effected in this government from a confederated republic, to a national sectional despotism." Charleston Mercury 2 days before the November 1860 election

"They [the South] know that it is their import trade that draws from the people's pockets sixty to seventy millions of dollars per annum, in the shape of duties, to be expended mainly in the North, and in the protection and encouragement of Northern interests. These are the reasons why these people do not wish the South to secede from the Union. They, the North, are enraged at the prospect of being despoiled of the rich feast upon which they have so long fed and fattened, and which they were just getting ready to enjoy with still greater gout and gusto. They are mad as hornets because the prize slips them just as they are ready to grasp it. These are the reasons why these people [the North] do not wish the South to secede from the Union." The New Orleans Daily Crescent 21 January 1861

On November 19, 1860 Senator Robert Toombs gave a speech to the Georgia convention in which he denounced the "infamous Morrill bill." The tariff legislation, he argued, was the product of a coalition between abolitionists and protectionists in which "the free-trade abolitionists became protectionists; the non-abolition protectionists became abolitionists." Toombs described this coalition as "the robber and the incendiary... united in joint raid against the South."

"Before... the revolution [the South] was the seat of wealth, as well as hospitality....Wealth has fled from the South, and settled in regions north of the Potomac: and this in the face of the fact, that the South, in four staples alone, has exported produce, since the Revolution, to the value of eight hundred millions of dollars; and the North has exported comparatively nothing. Such an export would indicate unparalleled wealth, but what is the fact? ... Under Federal legislation, the exports of the South have been the basis of the Federal revenue.....Virginia, the two Carolinas, and Georgia, may be said to defray three-fourths of the annual expense of supporting the Federal Government; and of this great sum, annually furnished by them, nothing or next to nothing is returned to them, in the shape of Government expenditures. That expenditure flows in an opposite direction - it flows northwardly, in one uniform, uninterrupted, and perennial stream. This is the reason why wealth disappears from the South and rises up in the North. Federal legislation does all this." ----Missouri Senator Thomas Hart Benton

[To a Northern Congressman] "You are not content with the vast millions of tribute we pay you annually under the operation of our revenue laws, our navigation laws, your fishing bounties, and by making your people our manufacturers, our merchants, our shippers. You are not satisfied with the vast tribute we pay you to build up your great cities, your railroads, your canals. You are not satisfied with the millions of tribute we have been paying you on account of the balance of exchange, which you hold against us. You are not satisfied that we of the South are almost reduced to the condition of overseers of Northern Capitalist. You are not satisfied with all this; but you must wage a relentless crusade against our rights and our institutions." Rep. John H. Reagan of Texas

"Northerners are the fount of most troubles in the new Union. Connecticut and Massachusetts exhaust our strength and substance and its inhabitants are marked by such a perversity of character they have divided themselves from the rest of America - Thomas Jefferson in an 1820 letter

"I tried all in my power to avert this war. I saw it coming, for twelve years I worked night and day to prevent it, but I could not. The North was mad and blind; it would not let us govern ourselves, and so the war came, and now it must go on till the last man of this generation falls in his tracks, and his children seize the musket and fight our battle, unless you acknowledge our right to self government. We are not fighting for slavery. We are fighting for Independence, and that, or extermination." - President Jefferson Davis The Atlantic Monthly Volume 14, Number 83

“And slavery, you say, is no longer an element in the contest.” Union Colonel James Jaquess

“No, it is not, it never was an essential element. It was only a means of bringing other conflicting elements to an earlier culmination. It fired the musket which was already capped and loaded. There are essential differences between the North and the South that will, however this war may end, make them two nations.” Jefferson Davis

Davis rejects peace with reunion https://cwcrossroads.wordpress.com/2013/03/03/jefferson-davis-rejects-peace-with-reunion-1864/

26 posted on 08/01/2022 9:22:25 AM PDT by FLT-bird
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

The Republican Party was formed to end slavery:

“The final nail in the Whig coffin was the Kansas–Nebraska Act, passed by Democrats in 1854. It was also the spark that began the Republican Party, which would take in both Whigs and Free Soilers and create an anti-slavery party that the Whigs had always resisted becoming. The Act opened Kansas Territory and Nebraska Territory to slavery and future admission as slave states, thus implicitly repealing the prohibition on slavery in territory north of 36° 30′ latitude that had been part of the Missouri Compromise. This change was viewed by anti-slavery Northerners as an aggressive, expansionist maneuver by the slave-owning South. Opponents of the Act were intensely motivated and began forming a new party. The Party began as a coalition of anti-slavery Conscience Whigs such as Zachariah Chandler and Free Soilers such as Salmon P. Chase.”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Republican_Party_(United_States)

Republican Abraham Lincoln was elected President....


32 posted on 08/01/2022 9:26:39 AM PDT by Brian Griffin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

I’ll take Lincoln’s own word for it. He said the recent unpleasantness was NOT about slavery.


34 posted on 08/01/2022 9:29:08 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp; rockrr; DoodleDawg; BroJoeK; jmacusa
Time to give it up, Diogenes. You think the North got the South's cotton money and used it to buy imports and that somehow the money rightly belonged to the South. That's fallacious in itself. Money circulates, and people who get money through exports can use the money to buy domestic products. The money is no longer theirs. They have already used it to buy what they want.

On top of that, you left one big thing out. In his book Heyday: Britain and the Birth of the Modern World Ben Wilson relates that in the 1850s Britain invested over $1 billion dollars in the US. So there were plenty of pounds coming into the US for investment. They were changed into dollars to buy US stocks and bonds, and those pounds could be used to buy British goods. The case was similar with France and other European countries, though the numbers were smaller.

If you studied economics, you would know that investment flows are a big part of the balance of payments. But don't feel bad. I didn't remember that until now.

35 posted on 08/01/2022 9:30:25 AM PDT by x
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp
Well this looks like the makings of a fun thread.

Amazing how 150 years after the Civil War, all the Northerners now want to move South. Now even the car companies are building factories down there while Detroit looks more and more like a war-ravaged ruin.

38 posted on 08/01/2022 9:31:21 AM PDT by SamAdams76 (3,631,515 users on Truth Social)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp
Rather than bring up the Civil War which people are still on different sides of the fence over, Ayn Rand's statement could be used to reference our globalist/fascist problems.

All Western governments are doing whatever they want, people be damned, because they want to get rid of the middle class globally so that everyone will be like the people of China. Subservient and tightly controlled worker drones.

44 posted on 08/01/2022 9:36:30 AM PDT by Pollard (If there's a question mark in the headline, the answer should always be No.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

If the South had been allowed to peacefully secede, as was their constitutional right, slavery would have died a natural death, just as it did everywhere else in the West.

The U.S. would’ve become 6 or 8 confederacies of states, with no foreign ambitions.

Thus, no foreign entanglements, no Jim Crow era, and no constant saber-rattling.

No Federal Reserve, no federal income tax, no border crisis, and no bureaucratic Empire in the Beltway.

Lincoln’s war hurt everyone, then and now.


47 posted on 08/01/2022 9:41:21 AM PDT by BrexitBen
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: DiogenesLamp

For later


53 posted on 08/01/2022 9:47:55 AM PDT by texanyankee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-37 next last

Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson