Posted on 06/27/2021 8:33:55 AM PDT by TheWriterTX
There is a lot of misinformation floating around FR on the Miami condominium collapse. As a high-rise condominium manager, this story hit home. So here is a quick primer to help people combat fake news.
First, this is not an apartment complex. In an apartment complex, an investor or group of investors owns the building and everyone is a transient tenant. It is a for-profit business. If there are major repairs needed, landlords can raise the rents to cover repairs.
This is a condominium. Each unit has a separate owner, they purchase it with a mortgage or cash.
Every month, unit pay assessments to cover the operational expenses of the building (water, electric, maintenance, staff, grounds, pool, portering, systems, etc.). The condominium functions under a non-profit Association.
Each year, the owners have an Annual Meeting to vote for a Board of Directors. The same way we elect representatives to make laws and spending decisions on our behalf, so too does this community.
It is important to note that condominiums and homeowners associations are self-funded. They only have the money that the owners give it. If there is a big, expensive repair needed, and the association does not have enough money set aside to do it, then the Board must call for a special assessment to raise the money. The special assessment is in addition to the regular monthly assessments and must be approved by the owners (usually 67% must vote yes).
If the manager brought this to the board and the board did not move ahead, the liability is now on the board and there is nothing the building manager can do other than resign. If the board brought this issue to the communuty and the owners did not vote to approve, there is nothing the building manager could do other than resign. The liability falls back on the individual owners for refusing to fix it.
Approximately 2.5 years ago, the building had a structural engineer evaluate spalling, cracking in the underground parking garage, and building envelope issues. The report warned then that major repairs were needed and that structural integrity was compromised.
The building manager should have recommended and the board should have voted to approve having the engineering firm create a scope and then gone out to bid ASAP while calling for a massive special assessment. If they did not, they are in trouble.
Another issue that was impacting this building was land movement. Parts of the building were shifting at different degrees. All of these were putting stressors on the building envelope, as evidenced by external cracks and lawsuits for water intrusion.
So, the long and short is this:
1. There were warning signs the building was in trouble.
2. There were engineer reports the building was in trouble.
3. This was not some McAfee conspiracy theory controlled demo false flag event.
4. If the manager raised the alarm and the board/community did nothing, the manager is not liable.
5. If the board raised the alarm and the owners did nothing, the owners are liable to each other. Let the lawsuit party begin.
6. Buildings are evaluated every 40 years by law. Annual building inspections typically only deal with fire life safety equipment, boikers, chillers, elebators and other components, not structural. That may change in light of this event.
7. People blaming DeSantis are delusional. Give them a dime and tell them to buy a clue.
Boikers and elebators are always cause trouble in buildings like this. They should be outlawed.
Is your boiker elebated or are you just happy to see me?
That will be one for the courts to decide. I do not know the internals of how they were addressing it, just the steps typically taken to address major work.
Sorry for the spelling errors.
It should have read boilers and elevators. Old eyes...
“I read somewhere that the special assessment to fix the problems could have been as much as 100 thousand per unit. Dunno if true.”
First thought if I lived there, would be to sell my unit. The second thought is that if I didn’t disclose the report to the new owner (assuming that I knew of it), there goes my retirement, and maybe my freedom.
In other words, once the condition is known to you, it’s too late. Similar to having a foundation going south in your house - you’re stuck with it.
pretty much every city employee in P&Z, etc., is home and NOT working. You can barely get plans approved; no one answers the phone, no one is in, emails don’t get returned.
this has turned into a lazy government employee disney world
“Probably concrete pilings hammered in. Betcha when all is said and done and they pull these out the will see saltwater eroded concrete and re-bar. Salt water raises hell with concrete “
True, but in this case, it was the pool that was leaking into the parking below, because its seal wasn’t maintained.
I didn’t see mention of the possibility the building was constructed improperly from the get go and was a disaster waiting to happen.
There may be others involved than just the condo managers and owners.
You don’t often read of a large building in the United States just falling down.
Yes.
I wonder if boiker and elebator are destined to achieve the FR status of beeper / stuned / moose / cheese / sister / pancake bunny.
Does anybody know if there were pilings or caisons in the foundation?
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Many of the questions coming up here were discussed yesterday....
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3971196/posts
If you go to post 53, you can see that the complete set of architectural drawings are posted. I’m sure there are links there to the reports as well....
separate question; what if the manager is an employee of the association (not a 3rd party entity) and lives on site. Any difference or vulnerability in that scenario?
It was the pool deck aka entire patio around the pool. It was not properly sloped and the water pooled up causing seepage through the slab and on the ocean that included salt.
Concrete and rebar dont like salt
“Does anybody know if there were pilings or caisons in the foundation? Or it could have been a failure at the top.”
there’s an excellent video showing the collapse: it collapsed starting from the bottom ...
With major structural damage like this was $100,000 per unit does not seem unreasonable!! Once the building is up I would imagine it becomes far more difficult to repair this kind of damage to make the building stable!!!
There was a condo unit in San Francisco that had this problem on a MAJOR scale owners just moved out and sued the developer who of course filed bankruptcy!! I think the building is still there no one living in it and it is only 10 years old!! Looks like all who purchased their condos are just SCREWED however during the building process I am wondering IF the building inspectors can be responsible for signing off!!
There was no change of ownership, thus no complete inspection, only routine city inspections and routine procedures to get the original owners (all the Tenants) to pay for building maintenance.
It was a missed opportunity, by circumstance, to repair critical structural issues.
you totally forgot hugh and series
And Android helped me out by correcting beeber to beeper
Still fails to answer the most pressing question...
At least 20% of the Florida Atlantic coast has condos and hotels built on it.
There are literally thousands of buildings - many of them have been there for fifty years, or even longer.
None of them have suddenly collapsed and killed hundreds of people.
Until proven otherwise, I am still going with a terrorist attack on a heavily Jewish neighborhood.
Until they clear away enough rubble to inspect the columns on the lowest parking level, this catastrophe is still an unsolved mystery.
The swimming pool collapsed the parking garage, the inspector said the pool was in bad shape and installed wrong and would cost a lot to repair it correctly.
Watch this video which shows the building crumbling before it fell.
“ Mike, a political strategist, was on a business trip to Washington when Cassie called him at 1:30 in the morning, frantic that the building had shook. She was on the phone with him when she looked out the window and saw a sinkhole where the swimming pool had been. Then the line went dead.”
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