Posted on 04/23/2020 7:09:43 AM PDT by Golden Eagle
Almost no one believes that China actually built this virus as a bioweapon, but also purposely released it on themselves in late 2019. I don’t, but those that do point to the rebellion in Taiwan (which has since been put down), the trade war with the US that China appears to be losing, the willingness of the Chinese to use asymmetric warfare and even kill their own people if the ultimate ends are met, etc.
No, what those that believe that China is guilty of biological warfare believe is that once the virus was attacking, and crippling China, that Chinese leadership made a conscience decision to keep that information secret, and thereby allow the virus to penetrate, and infect, the rest of the world. The goal would be to make sure that not only China suffered from the outbreak, but the rest of the world, suffered at least equally as bad. If true, it would likely qualify as a bioweapon attack according to various treaties/agreements around the world. And the theory primarily gained life when Rush Limbaugh referenced an opinion article that appears to have been written by a DoD advisor.
Hope that helps.
That’s just as silly only in the other direction. OF COURSE they lied. And withheld. You think we’re being completely honest? You think ANY country is being completely honest? Countries are run by politicians. Politicians lie.
Well if they lied about the highly contagious ability of a deadly disease, that was initiating its spawn within their country, without shutting down travel to/from their country for weeks, if not months, then that very well may be considered a biological attack on the rest of the world. Have you not seen the lawsuits from US States being filed against the Chinese just the last few days? Those may not have standing, due to the various treaties between the nations of the world, but that is what they are accusing China of. Probably just a matter of time before these or other similar cases end up in international courts.
Rebellion in Tawain????
You do know that’s not part of mainland China but seperate nation? If you’re talking about Hong Kong, just because the media isn’t covering it doesn’t mean it’s over.
It’s only a biological attack if you really really want war. Mexico lied about swine flu. We’re lying right now about 19. Yeah I’ve seen the lawsuits. They’re laughably stupid and will result in a lot of wasted time and energy and nothing else. If by matter of time you mean 20 years from now, sure, maybe. And the international court will officially wag their finger at China, and the world will move on.
Really this desperate need to blame is stupid and a waste. When was the last time you saw a problem solved by blaming somebody. Now’s the time to fix it.
“At this point, what difference does it make” right? Some do think that way, I suppose we can agree on that.
Like I said and you studiously ignored: when have you seen a problem solved by blame?
Countless times. Ever heard the term “root cause analysis?” What are some of the reasonS (plural) you think they exist, or do you think they are 100% unnecessary?
What you call blame, others refer to as responsibility, accountability, etc, and it is typically something a conservative is very interested in.
WRONG. Zero times. Root cause analysis is completely different from the blame game. In fact RCA is the exact opposite. It’s about figuring out institutional and procedural failures instead of pointing the finger at some poor shlub. Blaming is about avoiding preventing it in the future, you make some schmuck the fall guy, change nothing, and act surprised when it happens again.
So now we’re getting to the bottom of it, you clearly think China/Xi is just “some poor shlub” huh. And because of that, you don’t want any root cause analysis being done on anything they were involved in. Got it.
No. I’m pointing out that blaming China accomplished nothing. So we all look at China, say “shame shame shame” make them run through a bunch of international court cases that mean nothing, and then what? Nothing changes. If you want to CHANGE things, so maybe these bugs stop coming out of China we need to move away from the blame game, work WITH them and help them improve their situation. That’s the difference between blame and RCA.
Blame: China did the bad, bad bad bad
RCA: Let’s figure out what got China in that situation, and help fix it
Blame perpetuates the problem. RCA prevents it from recurring.
You sound just like the naive liberals that believe people shouldn’t ever be held accountable for their actions. No responsibility ever required, even when we show them the light, ask them to change, and they just keep doing whatever they want anyway. You really think China wants our help? They won’t even let us in the lab to determine what happened. You know, so we can perform a root cause analysis in case the virus leaked from there, which is a distinct possibility that their hiding only seems to increase the probability of.
And the possibility that many believe that China knowingly withheld evidence of how deadly the virus was, yet allowed it to spread around the world, you said that was a no-brainier right? But you want no responsibility for that, either. You can keep replying, but your hole is only getting deeper.
No, I sound like someone that’s worked for bad and good corporations and understands the long term effects of the blame game. If you want to cultivate a culture where people (or countries) focus on obfuscation and avoiding responsibility you focus on blame and punishment. If you want to cultivate a culture where people (or countries) focus on solving problems and avoiding them in the future you focus on team work and fixing procedures.
Do want China to want our help? Or do you want them to be more secretive? Calling it an act of war and demanding a pound of flesh just encourages China to hide these situations in the future, so nobody finds out they have a superbug running around until after it has escaped (and they hope not even then). The only way to avoid this in the future is for China to see the international health community as a tool that can help them deal with these things in the future.
The whole reason root cause analysis was invented was realizing the blame game only perpetuates the problem. If you want root cause analysis stop blaming.
We’ve asked for access to the lab, to better assess what may have happened, and they’re denying it. So who’s the team player, and who is not? You do know one of their scientists admitted, but only AFTER the outbreak, that they have the closest resembling coronavirus to covid-19 in that lab, and it’s been hidden from the rest of the world there since 2013? Was that being a team player? Are you finally willing to admit that deserves investigation, for a root cause analysis as to whether it’s related to covid-19, and China should allow the US access to the lab? Or is that still just the blame game, and China is still the unfair victim in your mind. Just trying to find anything you’re willing to admit China needs to do, instead of what you keep insisting everyone else should be doing to placate them.
The only way to avoid this in the future is for China to see the international health community as a tool that can help them deal with these things in the future.
LOL you mean like the WHO? They have been helping China every way possible to obfuscate how deadly the virus was, where it may have come from, etc. So they have been helping China deal with it exactly the way China wants to deal with it, which is why President Trump cut their funding. I bet that REALLY upset you. Here before long you’ll be claiming how much better it would be for Mr. Pro-China himself Joe Biden to be our president too, based on all your other comments so far.
If you want root cause analysis stop blaming.
Quit accusing those simply attempting to perform a root cause analysis of unfairly placing the blame. But blame does tend to inevitably go towards those who have been, and continue to, hide things, as China has done.
Of course they’re denying it. We’re looking for blame and a pound of flesh. And they know that. Why would they cooperate with us now? It’s not in their best interest. Especially not with fools suing them.
I never said no investigation. I said no BLAME. Massive difference, which I’ve explained to you multiple times and you still refuse to listen.
The WHO is only as good as the cooperation they get. Also keep in mind that our own agencies like the CDC and NIH try to help too. But again, only as good as the cooperation they get. And the cooperation they get will be largely dependent on what China is getting from the rest of the world. Shame and blame will encourage them to not help. Because it won’t help them.
I didn’t say anything about fair or unfair. I’m talking about USEFUL for USELESS. Blame is, was and always will be USELESS. If you actually bothered to learn anything about RCA you’d know the FIRST rule of RCA is STOP BLAMING PEOPLE. so do you want to RCA or not?
I have no doubt this was made in China.
LOL. I’m the one that originally brought up the term Root Cause Analysis, remember? Maybe not, your situational awareness seems extremely low. Not trying to get personal, but you apparently did not notice my tagline at the bottom of every post, either. Here’s what it says:
Was the missing link between RATG13 and COVID-19 in the Wuhan Lab?
Maybe in your case you see that as prematurely, unfairly, and ignorantly outright accusing the poor victim China of something they couldn’t possibly be guilty of. That’s what you keep accusing everyone of, despite abundant evidence to the contrary. We just want answers, and if guilt needs to be applied, make sure it’s appropriately applied. That’s what conservatives do. You, on the other hand, seem to be particularly offended that China might be implicated. The only thing left to figure out really is if your heart bleeds for everyone else, or if this outrage is more specific to the issue.
I know you’re the one that brought it up. And you’re also the one that doesn’t want to follow the most basic rules of how to do it effectively. Which is why I ask the question.
You can blame
or
You can fix the root cause
PICK ONE
You’re talking in circles again. A root cause analysis, and teamwork between nations, requires access to the Chinese lab in Wuhan, which they are denying, and you have been here endlessly defending them denying that access.
Hence, a logical analysis of your position is that China rules. They don’t want to allow root cause analysis, nor be a team player, and you still refuse to condemn them for any reason. You claim that would be playing “the blame game” and that China should be allowed to lie, in this specific case, because all governments lie at some point and are entitled to to protect themselves.
That is your position, and you are entitled to it. Just don’t assume it fooled or convinced anyone on a conservative website.
No. Actually you’re the one talking in circles. You just want blame blame blame. You keep mentioning RCA but your addiction to blame goes 100% against that.
It’s not about position. It’s about fact. And the facts are long known. Blame addiction PREVENTS RCA and process repair. What you want it to perpetuate the problem. You want your pound of flesh, and that’s all you care about. And all your talk about RCA is simply lying to yourself and all around you. This isn’t even about conservative or liberal. This is about fix it or don’t. And you don’t want to fix it.
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