Posted on 01/24/2019 4:29:34 PM PST by daniel1212
I saw this ad on Twitter and was a little taken aback, so I naturally shared it with my family. That includes my dad.
My dad’s an incredible person in many ways. He’s smart, funny, and kind. He’s a man’s man. He wrestled and was all-conference in football in high school. He won a college scholarship to play football, but messed up both his knees senior year, so he went to tech school instead and learned to run heavy equipment.
That’s what he was doing when I was born - running dragline, digging ditches, building roads. Union work.
He decided it was a tough life for a family, so he went back to college during the winters and earned a degree in chemistry. Then he went on to get a PhD in physical chemistry. He’s worked as a chemist for many years now in a sugar beet refinery.
It’s not a cushy job - factory work. He’s up and down huge flights of stairs, on the concrete floors, going between boiling and freezing temperatures. He works with people who might have anything from a high school diploma to business degrees, to farmers. He’s in his mid-sixties, and he still works 12 hour days in the factory.
Working as he does in industry, he oversees employees all the time. He’s had to manage employees for over thirty years. He’s earned the respect of his company because he treats everyone - male and female, with respect 100% of the time. He demands everyone treat each other the same way. Sexual harassment simply isn't tolerated.
He has had a large hand in the way his company’s policies have been shaped over the last decades. I know this more than most daughters would because we’re from a small community. My friends worked for him. I worked at the same company for awhile, though not directly under him, I got to observe the results of his management style. I couldn't be more proud.
My dad is an incredible storyteller. My favorite story as a kid was about how his dog Tag chased the town bullies, the Nockamoose boys, out of the park once. He didn't like bullies, and neither did we, and I loved having a dad who was brave enough as a kid to do something about that.
My dad and mom bought our family a TI-99/4a when I was only 5 years old, even though it was a huge financial sacrifice for our family. This was a big discussion between my parents, but my dad won because he thought it was really important that my sister and I be comfortable with computers. I surprised him by writing a program on it only a couple of weeks later.
He brought me to the lab when he started teaching. He taught me how to conduct experiments. When I started working in a research lab, he encouraged and mentored me. He encouraged my sister and me to learn other skills as well. He taught us to change tires, to fix ball bearings, to repair windows, to change oil, drive a stick shift, and go hunting. Is it any surprise I became a chemist and my sister an aerospace engineer?
Last year, after his 13 year old springer spaniel died, he adopted a 5 year old dog from the shelter that wasn't even housebroken because it looked terribly happy to see him, and because the dog had been there for two years.
My dad is the kind of person who buys something from every kid who comes around selling anything. His chosen charity for Amazon Prime is the women’s shelter. He built a ramp for his mom when she needed help getting in and out of her house. He visits his great-aunts, especially the one without children.
He teaches Sunday School and pays great attention to how he is a role model to the boys and young men at church. He spends time every night reading his Bible, and reflecting on how he can be a better person as well. He says living your life well isn't about you - it’s about how you serve God and you serve others - the two great commandments.
He will drive 3 hours to help his sister install a toilet, three hours home, and then come home and get down on knees that are getting arthritic and wrap my mother’s legs tenderly, like he does twice a day every day, because she has lymphedema.
Did I mention that? My mom’s disabled - and I've never once heard him complain about it, even though her disability has demanded significant compromises and sacrifices on both their parts. She’s been in a wheelchair completely now for seven years, but has been unable to work for over thirty. She spends weeks in the hospital every year, sometimes more. We've been through doctors all over the state, and some of the best specialists in the nation.
Sometimes she gets down about it, and you know what he does? He never, ever agrees with her. He brings her roses.
My dad is EVERYTHING that a man should be.
He is all the best things a human being can be - but moreover, he is all the best things a man can be. He embodies the best of masculine strength. He has sacrificed a great deal for our family. He is tough and determined and embodies perseverance.
He’s EVERYTHING that the ad supposedly encourages men to be.
When I showed the Gillette ad to my dad, he tensed up. Halfway through, he told me to turn it off. “I've seen enough. I don’t need to be insulted any more.”
So - do you want to know why this ad lost my dad? Do you want to know why such an AMAZING man - a fantastic role model - was disgusted? Really?
Let’s start at the beginning.
“Bullying” “The #MeToo Movement” “Toxic Masculinity”
Is this the best a man can get? Is it?
Right about here. Gillette lost him here.
Right here the advertisement framed the rest of the piece in terms of opposing patriarchy and set itself up in the far left feminist and Marxist camp.[1] Gillette implied the best of men is bullying, rape, and toxic.
They asked “Is this the best a man can get? Is it?” Challenging. As if that’s what anyone ever thought “the best” was. As if that’s what most men were in the first place.
But of course, no one’s allowed to say that anymore. It’s a “sexist argument”. It’s “derailment[2]”. You can’t say “Not all men[3][4][5][6][7]” Even though it is true - not even MOST men bully. Or rape. Or are toxic. On any objective standard. Yes,there’s too much bullying. And rape, and toxicity.
Yet this argument has already set itself up that all men behave in this manner - and if you don’t, kindly shut up, this argument isn't about you. Now any defense of men has been declared misogynist. Any defense of any particular man is misogynist. The standard is collective guilt.
Everything that follows is now poisoned. Because Gillette poisoned it. My dad recognized what those lines were invoking. He understood the ad was invoking a far left Marxist oppressors/oppressed framework of thinking about relationships.
It’s been going on far too long
We can’t laugh it off, Making the same old excuses >> Boys will be boys / boys will be boys / boys will be boys
You know this is ridiculous. Very few people laugh off bullying or rape. Oh - it’s been dismissed, all right - but “boys will be boys”? Really? Putting this again in the context of #metoo which was explicitly about sexual harassment and rape - and again, the first sentences framed it that every man was guilty.
Every man, in every community, no matter what his record, no matter how his business handled things, no matter how he conducted his private life, bears this collective shame. The wall of men barbecuing, mindlessly repeating the mantra proves the point.
And of course, we know this is inherently wrong with any other group - but for some reason, it’s fine when the target is men. Because “power”. Those are THE RULES™ . (Helen Pluckrose has written an excellent rebuttal to this)
I've been raped. I've been harassed. I've been offered a quid pro quo in a professional capacity. I've been fired for being a whistle blower. I've had a campus police officer BLAME ME for being stalked. Heaven knows I’m 100% aware of exactly how many people out there view other people as things to be used.
But I also had men stand up for me, defend me, help me, teach me, and protect me. Including my father. And those men are the majority. The bad ones - they are too frequent, but they are not the standard. This way of thinking about men - categorizing them as a group - it’s inherently evil.
But something finally changed >> allegations regarding sexual assault and sexual harassment >> toxic masculinity
And we’re back to “Toxic Masculinity”. The APA issued a report defining “traditional masculinity” as harmful. The psychologists behind the report, unsurprisingly, discuss the harmful role of the Patriarchy, again going back to far left.
“Traditional masculinity is psychologically harmful and that socializing boys to suppress their emotions causes damage that echoes both inwardly and outwardly.”[8] It also eschews “stoicism, competitiveness, dominance and aggression”.
You know, my dad is very stoic[9], sometimes to the point of being frustrating - but he wept when his father died. I was with him then. He’s found a few other occasions that emotion overwhelmed him. Masculine strength isn't from some twisted self-denial. It comes from discipline, faith, and love, and the support of family as well.
And there will be no going back Because we? We believe in the best in men >>>> Men need to hold other men accountable
Well whoop-de-doo. Pat yourself on the back. That’s what moral men have been doing for millennia.
Oh, right, a lot of people don’t do that whole God and church and Bible and Jesus thing do they? So I guess they need their razor company to tell them this.
To say the right thing To act the right way
Some already are In ways big and small
But some is not enough >>> that’s not how we treat each other, ok? Because the boys watching today Will be the men of tomorrow
The sad thing is he never even got to this part. This part he’d agree with - this part is completely uncontroversial. This is the part he’s lived his entire life by. This is what his dad taught him. His mom, too, for that matter. Because real men treat other people with respect.
If you asked him, my dad would tell you His strength comes from discipline and his faith in God.
And if you’re really hungry for knowing how to live a good life, there’s a Good Book he can recommend. https://www.bible.com/
What’s always puzzled me about this is, if a QB can throw a football better with a little less air pressure, why not let all teams’ QBs use a ball inflated to grip and throw best for them?
Are the the NFL rules intended to make the QBs less effective and efficient?
Sorry, I somehow jumped back to the previous thread I was readng.
That Gillette message is what the Quora poster is also attacking, quite well.
So Gillette is added to my “don’t buy” list.
With this Quora answer getting over 5,400 Upvotes (out of 100+ Answers) and most popular answers also being in opposition to Gillette (one gets 4,500+ upvotes) and an pro Gillette one gets 29 upvotes, it seems Gillette has lost many customers.
If Kristine truly is at a loss for her Dad’s reaction then I would suggest she needs to relearn the things her father attempted to show/teach her throughout life.
Because that commercial did nothing but attempt to shame men and boys.
She was endorsing Bullying by Marketing Means and was too ignorant to even realize it.
Because Gillette thinks football is "Toxic Masculinity” and too much air makes it worse? (I know you posted on the wrong thread but maybe we can make this relevant.)
Thanks for the report. I use an electric most days.
How was she endorsing Bullying by Marketing Means and was too ignorant to even realize it, rather than actually describing the nature of it? Where did she not agree the commercial attempted to shame men and boys? How much of the article did you read, in context?
Well, as much as Roger Goodell is influenced by political correctness, it is possible that the air pressure rule is intended to limit how toxic and effective the QBs can be. But Brady appears to have preferred less air to be more toxic.
I suspect Roger not so Goodell would affirm the Gillette ad. Over-inflated liberalism.
Yep, Goodell is all in on all the PC and social justice causes.
Indeed, the wheel$$$ of justice will catch up with their bottom line.
Hi, daniel11212 -
I read the entire article; thank you for asking, though. LOL
She was upset that her father didn’t want to watch the entire commercial. She said he said, “I’ve seen enough.”
As a man/husband(lover to her mother)/father it seems as if he was the ideal man. She as much as said that for us to understand. She was quite proud of his wonderful traits in all those roles.
And yet, yet, she couldn’t see his intelligence in rejecting the commercial outright. And the reason she couldn’t see his intelligence in rejecting the commercial outright? Because she was herself a narrow minded, feminist, who wanted to show her father how men should be.
She took it upon herself, to point to a commercial which shoved an ignorant, irrational point of view to a man who lived his life to the BEST HE COULD BE.
And she, being a ‘woke’ woman, well, she was to ‘woke’ to see she herself was insulting her father.
Look back at the article. She pointed out all the wonderful things he did. She took great time to go into detail about the way he lived/lives his life. And yet, she did not even know him enough....wait for it.... AS A MAN... to know it would offend him.
In her mind, it was all about HER, and about FEMINIST, and about WOKE WOMEN and WOKE MEN who were showing the world of ignorant man how it should be done.
And she wondered why he was offended enough to not want to finish watching the spiel of finely crafted hate.
I don’t doubt that he was and is a gentle, loving, protective, providing, and caring farther.
What is really clear is that somewhere in her mind, she thought he would approve of bullying.
Bullying comes in all sizes and both genders. And some of the best, most vicious bullies I have ever had the displeasure of dealing with are...wait for it...women. Her father was probably quietly stunned at her apparent pleasure in the direction of the commercial. His problem, how to tell his daughter that she may be part of the problem, especially if she (and apparently she does) agrees with the commercial.
I am glad you took the time to post a reply. It’s always a pleasure to communicate, even if there is a difference of opinion.
“The sad thing is he never even got to this part. “
___________________________________________________
You see that line?
That, my dear daniel1212 is what is the line that defined her entire article.
And she never understood why her father wouldn’t stay to watch the male of the gender being slammed wholesale.
It’s a shame.
Again, bullying comes in all sizes and both genders.
Aren’t there knives that can cut so finely that you don’t feel it until the blood is seen?
Her article is one such knife.
Saving this very good article that describes her father as a real man opposed to so-called toxic masculinity as well as wimps.
Thanks for posting the entire article.
It is crap crap crap and more crap. My most hated part in the propaganda piece is “some men are already doing it”. Not MOST men, just SOME.
Complete SJW, virtue signaling, crap.
“I saw this ad on Twitter and was a little taken aback, so I naturally shared it with my family. That includes my dad.”
The author was “a little taken aback”.
“He’s EVERYTHING that the ad supposedly encourages men to be.”
The word “supposedly” means something there.
“They asked “Is this the best a man can get? Is it?” . . . As if that’s what most men were in the first place.”
She’s clearly taking the position that it’s only a few men who behave badly.
“The standard is collective guilt. Everything that follows is now poisoned. Because Gillette poisoned it.”
I think she’s completely on the side of decent people and completely against the anti-male version of feminism. You clearly read it differently, but please look again and see if my reading is a better match to her words. I think her knives are aimed at the left, intended to cut them, but doing so gently that perhaps a few leftists will keep reading and maybe learn something (the eternal optimism of youth).
Which contextually is an unwarranted interpretation, for rather than never understanding why her father wouldn’t stay to watch the male of the gender being slammed wholesale, she actually went on at length on why her father deplored the male of the gender being slammed wholesale. "So - do you want to know why this ad lost my dad? Do you want to know why such an AMAZING man - a fantastic role model - was disgusted? Really? Let’s start at the beginning. Bullying” “The #MeToo Movement” “Toxic Masculinity” Is this the best a man can get? Is it? Right about here. Gillette lost him here. Right here the advertisement framed the rest of the piece in terms of opposing patriarchy and set itself up in the far left feminist and Marxist camp.[1] Gillette implied the best of men is bullying, rape, and toxic...."
Thus "sad thing" part simply cannot contextually define her entire article, but in context is expressing that the only part of the ad that her dad would agree with would never be seen since her father wouldn’t stay to watch the male of the gender being slammed wholesale. She is in no way perplexed by his refusal to be tortured in order to get to a piece of candy in a cup of filth.
In some sense one might be say it was unfortunate that piece was never seen, but while you can criticize that choice of a word here, contextually it simply is not because she never understood why her father wouldn’t stay to get to a positive aspect. Instead she elaborates why this rejection is fully justified. Context is king in both Biblical interpretation and here.
Yes. The only criticism that I belatedly give is that while the author lists as creds being a "scientist, musician, and all-around learning enthusiast," if she is a mother why is this not listed, and if she is not a wife and mom, then why. Being a father also means raising daughters to favor marriage and motherhood as the norm.
That’s a good story.
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