Posted on 09/09/2018 3:35:18 PM PDT by PJ-Comix
One question that has intrigued me for years is HOW did the John Ford movie starring John Wayne, "Stagecoach," make it past the censors in 1939. Back in those days the Hollywood Code was strictly enforced yet "Stagecoach" clearly featured a prostitute which would have been prohibited. Even worse, she was portrayed in a sympathetic light.
Yeah, I know it did not explicitly say that Dallas the Prostitute, played by Clair Trevor, was a prostitute but the movie left no doubt that was the case. Particularly revealing was the scene in Lordsville when against her objections, the naive Ringo Kid (John Wayne) walked her to her new job and even he realized that Dallas was a hooker which was made obvious by all the hookers hanging out in the section of town where she was going.
Yet somehow, the censors let this pass. Wasn't there at least some sort of objection by the censors (mainly Joseph Bream who was really strict)? Anyway, still amazed that "Stagecoach" made it to the Silver Screen back in those days complete with it's all too obvious prostitute character.
Well, at least someone has found a diversion from the usual junk we are bombarded with every day. Why not?
Kind of like Kitty being a “madam” on Gunsmoke? Well, what else were the saloons for besides going there to get drunk and get shot? Never explicitly said but ~~~~~~~~~~!
“Prostitutes are part of western lore. “
Hence this little ditty about the California Gold Rush:
The miners came in ‘49,
the whores in ‘51.
When they got together,
they produced the native son.
Sorry - didn’t see your reply before I posted...I’m never going to vow again not to reply before I read all the postings.
The Hayes commission had very flexible rules
Moreover why do you care?
The oldest profession....
“”Didn’t they similarly have Belle Watling in GWTW put in a positive light despite her obvious line of work ?””
They didn’t hide that very well if that was their intention. I don’t think it was...must have thought it would be more real?
It's clear that Dallas is a prostitute, and that she's headed for the red light district, because she's convinced that she has nowhere else to go, when Ringo stops her and lets her know that he wants her for his wife. I'm sure that was shocking to 1939 audiences, but there was no explicit talk, no obscene language, no sex scenes. The subject matter was handled elegantly, as well as sympathetically. Maybe that's how they got it past the censors.
I love the way, as they traveled further westward, East Coast traditions and prejudices were one by one discarded until, at the frontier, her having been a prostitute was hardly even a consideration.
As I recall, she had been pressed into prostitution by circumstances. It think that was not uncommon in the Wild West.
If made today, Hollywood would make it a skin flick, with as much gross language and explicit sex as they could cram onto the screen. Hollywood is a cesspool today.
The civil war had even more prostitutes. The word Hooker comes from General Hooker. The General was known for having the women near the camp so he could manage his men. Hookers were on both sides in large numbers. America drank, paid for sex and gambled to access for most of its history.
bump
I would have too...
Yes, after I got my DNA tested, a woman contacted me and asked if I had any relatives who served in Virginia in the Civil War. I said: “Yes, my grandfather.” (He enlisted at age 16.) It turns out that we’re cousins, and she might be my grandfather’s grandaughter or great- or something.
THOSE WERE THE DAYS---No less a personage than mega-producer and Hollywood wonder-boy, Irving Thalberg, co-authored the Production Code, the set of moral guidelines that all film studios agreed to follow circa 1930-68.
WIKI The Motion Picture Production Code was the set of industry moral censorship guidelines that governed the production of most United States motion pictures released by major studios from 1930 to 1968. It is also popularly known as the Hays Code, after Hollywood's chief censor of the time, Will H. Hays.....a former postmaster.
The Motion Pictures Producers and Distributors of America (MPPDA), which later became the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA), adopted the code in 1930, began enforcing it in 1934, and abandoned it in 1968, in favor of the subsequent MPAA film rating system. The Production Code spelled out what was acceptable and what was unacceptable content for motion pictures produced for a public audience in the United States.
The office enforcing it was popularly called the Hays Office in reference to Hays, inaccurately so after 1934 when Joseph Breen took over from Hays, creating the Breen Office, which was far more rigid in censoring films than Hays had been.
The Code enumerated a number of key points known as the "Don'ts" and "Be Carefuls": Resolved, That those things which are included in the following list shall not appear in pictures produced by the members of this Association, irrespective of the manner in which they are treated:
1.Pointed profanity – by either title or lip – this includes the words "God," "Lord," "Jesus," "Christ" (unless they be used reverently in connection with proper religious ceremonies), "hell," "damn," "Gawd," and every other profane and vulgar expression however it may be spelled;
2.Any licentious or suggestive nudity-in fact or in silhouette; and any lecherous or licentious notice thereof by other characters in the picture;
3.The illegal traffic in drugs;
4.Any inference of sex perversion;
5.White slavery;
6.Miscegenation (sex relationships between the white and black races);
7.Sex hygiene and venereal diseases;
8.Scenes of actual childbirth – in fact or in silhouette;
9.Children's sex organs;
10.Ridicule of the clergy;
11.Willful offense to any nation, race or creed;
And be it further resolved, That special care be exercised in the manner in which the following subjects are treated, to the end that vulgarity and suggestiveness may be eliminated and that good taste may be emphasized:
1.The use of the flag;
2.International relations (avoiding picturizing in an unfavorable light another country's religion, history, institutions, prominent people, and citizenry);
3.Arson;
4.The use of firearms;
5.Theft, robbery, safe-cracking, and dynamiting of trains, mines, buildings, etc. (having in mind the effect which a too-detailed description of these may have upon the morale); 6.Brutality and possible gruesomeness;
7.Technique of committing murder by whatever method;
8.Methods of smuggling;
9.Third-degree methods;
10.Actual hangings or electrocutions as legal punishment for crime;
11.Sympathy for criminals;
12.Attitude toward public characters and institutions;
13.Sedition;
14.Apparent cruelty to children and animals;
15.Branding of people or animals;
16.The sale of women, or of a woman selling her virtue;
17.Rape or attempted rape;
18.First-night scenes;
19.Man and woman in bed together;
20.Deliberate seduction of girls;
21.The institution of marriage;
22.Surgical operations;
23.The use of drugs;
24.Titles or scenes having to do with law enforcement or law-enforcing officers.
With “The Roaring Twenties” and “The Hunchback of Notre Dame” as well as others, how can you lose?
Tough indeed. I've seen various photographs of the whores and they sure weren't models for Victoria's Secret. They were pretty rough looking, and some looked like cowpokes with a dresses on.
Pre-Code Hollywood refers to the brief era in the American film industry between the widespread adoption of sound in pictures in 1929 and the enforcement of the Motion Picture Production Code censorship guidelines, popularly known as the "Hays Code", in mid-1934. Although the Code was adopted in 1930, oversight was poor and it did not become rigorously enforced until July 1, 1934, with the establishment of the Production Code Administration (PCA). Before that date, movie content was restricted more by local laws, negotiations between the Studio Relations Committee (SRC) and the major studios, and popular opinion, than by strict adherence to the Hays Code, which was often ignored by Hollywood filmmakers.
As a result, some films in the late 1920s and early 1930s depicted or implied sexual innuendo, miscegenation, mild profanity, illegal drug use, promiscuity, prostitution, infidelity, abortion, intense violence, and homosexuality. Strong female characters were ubiquitous in such pre-Code films as Female, Baby Face, and Red-Headed Woman. Gangsters in films like The Public Enemy, Little Caesar, and Scarface were seen by many as heroic rather than evil. Along with featuring stronger female characters, films examined female subject matters that would not be revisited until decades later in US films. Nefarious characters were seen to profit from their deeds, in some cases without significant repercussions, and drug use was a topic of several films. Many of Hollywood's biggest stars such as Clark Gable, Barbara Stanwyck, Joan Blondell, and Edward G. Robinson got their start in the era. Other stars who excelled during this period, however, like Ruth Chatterton (who decamped to England) and Warren William (the so-called "king of Pre-Code", who died in 1948), would wind up essentially forgotten by the general public within a generation.
The biggest audience for the more sexually lurid movies turned out to be women.
I find a lot of movies make prostitutes look like decent people.
I just watched “ Roughshod “ on TCM. The theme was a little similar to “ Stagecoach “ in that it’s about the journey from point a to point b. Saloon ladies (ahem) in peril. It was really good Gloria Graham plus the kid from The Yearling. Highly recommended by me. Had never heard of it. Thank goodness for TCM on a rainy day.
I’m guessing that since it wouldn’t be obvious to anyone under 18, unless extremely precocious, and it was only alluded to visually, and not really spelled out, it was let go. But there were a lot of movies that surprisingly passed, albeit with a higher age warning.
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