[cymbeline]

“the infantry is co-ed now”

Ok with me to give it a try.

Women are in submarines now. Guess why. Because there aren’t enough eligible men volunteering.

What happens if a woman gets her booty felt on the battlefield?

[Waverunner]

a blue on blue unauthorized weapons discharge?

[Wyrd bið ful aræd]

Except they're not just giving it a try, this is a permanent change and not a smart one. The Israelis tried this experiment and it failed, and they were realistic enough to roll it back. I don't expect our PC establishment to do the same sensible thing when it inevitably fails. The Marines did a study that pretty much kills the notion that this idea is in any way workable.

If you don't have enough eligible men, take steps to attract them. Revamp your recruiting media. Don't aggressively integrate women who are in 99% of cases also not eligible (in a sane world.)

When a platoon gets back from 3 weeks on patrol in the back of beyond Afghanistan, instead of stripping in a courtyard and getting hosed off, they have to figure out how to handle the one or two girls in the group. When facilities consist of a piss pipe and a hole in the ground in the corner of a foxhole (per a friend who spent 6 weeks straight in said foxhole with 3 other guys on the edge of a valley in Afghanistan, with insurgent snipers taking potshots all the while) they have to figure out how to take a shit with a girl sitting 2 feet away. When a 210 pound guy gets his leg shot off, better hope 110lb GI Jane doesn't have to carry 3 miles because that's the closest a medivac can land. When you've been getting shot for weeks and all you want to do is talk about those hot girls you saw in the Green Zone, better hope GI Jane isn't there to ruin the fun.

It needlessly complicates simple things and irreversibly damages the masculine warrior culture of combat arms.

[Wyrd bið ful aræd]

And I should add that I’ve never served — but I’m paraphrasing statements made to me by pretty much every infantry vet I know.

[Tallguy]

“Women are in submarines now. Guess why. Because there aren’t enough eligible men volunteering.”

Studies have shown that when women enter a profession, they tend to drive men out because they change the culture. So putting a few women on submarines guarantees that a percentage of men aren’t going to consider subs in the future. Heck the ones that are already in catch he’ll from their wives over it.

[RinaseaofDs]

Do you actually believe that? That there are not enough men volunteering?

[T-Bone Texan]

"...Women are in submarines now. Guess why. Because there aren’t enough eligible men volunteering..."

Um, that's not the reason.

FR is not the place for silly gender warfare arguments.

[rottndog]

Women are in submarines now. Guess why. Because there aren’t enough eligible men volunteering.

Um...no...women on boats has nothing to do with manning requirements...it's 100% PC BS.

Ironically, the presence of women will make manning more difficult. Life on a submarine is high tempo and incredibly stressful without women...throw in sexual tension that is inevitable, and overly sensitive women that can't handle the workload, and you are creating a very toxic environment which will drive down retention of men.

Then there is the cost/benefit analysis of coed boats. Early results show very poor retention rates for female submariners. Considering all the extra money needed to facilitate the presence of women--duplicate facilities for females at all points in the training pipeline and beyond, the cost per female on a boat is significantly higher. Throw in pregnant women who cannot serve on a deployed submarine, who then must be replaced or leave the crew short handed, and just from a fiscal standpoint it makes no sense. This in an era of ever tighter budgets.

Lot's of other reasons why women on boats, and in other front line combatant units, is stupid...just because we can do something doesn't mean we should. Fairness is irrelevant in warfare. The military needs the freedom to field the most effective fighting force possible...PC be damned.

---A former Submariner

[mewzilla]

What happens if a woman gets her booty felt on the battlefield?

If she belongs in the uniform, she'll coldcock whoever does it. Then get back to work.