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Interesting the Nazis did not learn from what happened the massive investment Germany made in the High Seas Fleet. That except for Jutland and some other sorties was a white elephant bottled up in harbor. Besides Jutland the High Seas Fleet is most famous for the mutiny starting the dominoes for Germany's capitulation. Think about what would of happened if Dornitz had access to more U-Boats in 1939/40.
1 posted on 01/06/2017 6:50:53 AM PST by C19fan
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To: C19fan

Or even more significant, what if Germany had paid attention to Gen. Billy Mitchell’s air attack demonstrations and invested in development of aircraft carriers for the North Atlantic? While the Luftwaffe failed to destroy England’s ability to fight from the air, they might have succeeded in destroying the Royal Navy, a vital asset to keep supplies from America flowing.


2 posted on 01/06/2017 6:54:15 AM PST by Cincinatus (Omnia relinquit servare Rempublicam)
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To: C19fan

America and Britain had plans to build a massive aircraft carrier made from pycrete, virtually indestructable to even the largest at the time shells or torpedos.
As long as it remained in the north atlantic it could regenerate itself from melting by using on board piped refrigeration. I saw plans of it some years ago.


3 posted on 01/06/2017 6:56:18 AM PST by Daniel Ramsey (MAGA)
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To: C19fan

That would have been a colossal waste of money.


4 posted on 01/06/2017 6:59:26 AM PST by samtheman (I voted for Trump without Russian help.)
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To: C19fan

The larger problem was fuel. They didn’t have enough fuel to run the fleet they had. They would have been better off with a smaller surface fleet and more tanks at the start of the war, particularly in 1941.


5 posted on 01/06/2017 7:00:13 AM PST by alternatives? (Why have an army if there are no borders?)
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To: C19fan
Also, many navy admirals around the world did NOT learn the lessons of US Army General William L. "Billy" Mitchell, who demonstrated that air power was going to make battleships and cruisers obsolete in that famous bombing test in 1921. Interestingly, the Imperial Japanese Navy and (somewhat reluctantly) the British Royal Navy did understand what Mitchell demonstrated, and the attack on the Italian fleet at Taranto in 1940 and the attack on the American fleet at Pearl Harbor in 1941 drove that point home.
6 posted on 01/06/2017 7:00:44 AM PST by RayChuang88 (FairTax: America's economic cure)
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To: C19fan

Nazis had lots of stupid ideas.

The P1000 Ratte - a 1000 ton tank with a battleship turret mounting 11 inch guns.
The Maus - A 128 ton tank with 128mm main gun and a 75mm coax.
The Panther - An over-engineered copy of the T-34. It was too complicated to manufacture quickly, so there were never enough.

On and on and on...


8 posted on 01/06/2017 7:03:10 AM PST by Little Ray (Freedom Before Security!)
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To: C19fan

Germany had “plans” for lots of things, including the massive transatlantic bomber the “Amerika” which never got off the drawing board.

You are right about the U-boats. At any given time, perhaps only 30 operational boats in the Atlantic/North Atlantic wreaked havoc. Still, Jutland was a technical victory in which the German low self-confidence put them in harbor, not the results. Moreover, the U-boat attack at Jutland was not coordinated with the surface fight or the Brits would have lost big. It’s a classic example of a guy who doesn’t have confidence, and who is winning but doesn’t “think” he’s winning.


9 posted on 01/06/2017 7:03:34 AM PST by LS ("Castles Made of Sand, Fall in the Sea . . . Eventually" (Hendrix))
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To: C19fan

Germany had “plans” for lots of things, including the massive transatlantic bomber the “Amerika” which never got off the drawing board.

You are right about the U-boats. At any given time, perhaps only 30 operational boats in the Atlantic/North Atlantic wreaked havoc. Still, Jutland was a technical victory in which the German low self-confidence put them in harbor, not the results. Moreover, the U-boat attack at Jutland was not coordinated with the surface fight or the Brits would have lost big. It’s a classic example of a guy who doesn’t have confidence, and who is winning but doesn’t “think” he’s winning.


16 posted on 01/06/2017 7:35:41 AM PST by LS ("Castles Made of Sand, Fall in the Sea . . . Eventually" (Hendrix))
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To: C19fan
WWII Germany's use of their existing battleship assets was a series of strategic blunders. Their tactics indicated that the German navy didn't fundamentally understand how to use capital ships in battle. When the battleships did venture out, they did it with the intention of protecting the asset rather than fighting other capital ships or fleets.

The Germans kept them mostly bottled up in port rather than risk a fleet-fleet engagement with the British. When they did venture out, they did in small battle groups.

Bismark was most successful at commerce raiding but ultimately was defeated because of this poor strategy. Graff Spee was lost because it was a single raider boxed by a marginally more capable British fleet of cruisers and bluffed into being scuttled. Tirpitz never did anything but move throughout protected ports and was eventually sunk at anchorage in a fjord in Norway.

Scharnhorst and Gneisenau may have been the exception because they did work in unison and did significant damage to the British before they were trapped in individual sorties.

26 posted on 01/06/2017 8:10:39 AM PST by pfflier
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To: C19fan

unfortunately for Germany and fortunately for the rest of the world. “Hitler’s plans” exceeded the Germany’s production of steel and other materials and exceed its source of raw materials required for the enormous amount of planned ships, Army vehicles, and aircraft. His starting of the war at least 5 years before the Army and Navy leaders had planned for it to begin and to be fully equipped, also was fortunate for the rest of the world.


28 posted on 01/06/2017 8:14:10 AM PST by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: C19fan

Britain had quite a number of those stupid little Swordfish torpedo planes. You you, just like the one that bagged the Bismark.


33 posted on 01/06/2017 8:47:28 AM PST by GingisK
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To: C19fan
As opposed to the Battle of Moon Sound and Operation Albion which essentially destroyed the remaining Russian naval threat to German advances in the Baltic?
41 posted on 01/06/2017 8:29:05 PM PST by rmlew ("Mosques are our barracks, minarets our bayonets, domes our helmets, the believers our soldiers.")
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