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To: metmom

I don’t think they were deranged. I think they were well meaning pious frauds, seeking to get people to believe for the good of their soul.

Paul in his early letters leads with a crucified christ. Early versions of Mark are absent the resurrected Christ.

Looking carfully at the signs of the messiah referenced in Matthew shows the prophecies in the old testament that are cited mostly don’t prophecy the messiah.

Mark didn’t think enough of the birth narratives to admit them. The author(s) of Luke didn’t know enough to get the dates right.

I have gone on and on. In short, I am not convinced. YMMV.


909 posted on 12/16/2013 9:52:10 AM PST by donmeaker
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To: donmeaker; metmom; GarySpFc; CynicalBear; boatbums; Iscool; Pelham
I have gone on and on. In short, I am not convinced. YMMV

You have been going on and on. And you have been refuted on every account. You just refuse to read the responses to you. 1st and 2nd Thessalonians were the earliest epistles, and earliest NT documents we have. This is what it says about Jesus Christ:

1 Thessalonians 4:

13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

1 Thessalonians 5:

But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. 2 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. 3 For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. 4 But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 5 You are all sons of light and sons of the day. We are not of the night nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as others do, but let us watch and be sober. 7 For those who sleep, sleep at night, and those who get drunk are drunk at night. 8 But let us who are of the day be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet the hope of salvation. 9 For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 who died for us, that whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with Him. 11 Therefore comfort each other and edify one another, just as you also are doing.

So we have here in the earliest dated epistle the preaching and exhortation of Paul saying: Christ had died, Christ is Risen, and Christ is Coming Again. Your first claim refuted, therefore the remaining points are irrelevant.

If you want to peddle a more than 4,000 year conspiracy theory drawing billions throughout history to God, then just say so. There are plenty of those websites out there peddling all sorts of revisionist whoppers.

914 posted on 12/16/2013 4:27:08 PM PST by redleghunter
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