Posted on 11/01/2012 3:33:35 PM PDT by BobL
Hi fellow FReepers,
Since we have some really good people on this site when it comes to survival techniques, I'm wondering if people have suggestions as to the best method to keep warm in the aftermath of an event like Hurricane Sandy in the Northeast (where temperatures will be in the 30s in the next day or so). While we all talk about having 20 acres and multiple pillboxes for when it happens, I suspect that most people, like myself, live in relatively modest houses, in communities where people are packed together relatively densely. In other words most of us likely live on 1/4 to 1/2 of an acre. Lots of us probably don't have fireplaces, or have the lousy pre-fab ones that can barely fit a log.
So here's the scenario, and assume this is well before the hurricane has hit...so there's plenty of time to buy supplies and equipment:
1) Your house doesn't have a fireplace (it may or may not have natural gas service - I'd like to explore both scenarios). 2) You will not have electricity for a month after the storm, and it's winter. 3) You can store up to 50 gallons of fuel (any fuel), although an outdoor propane tank would get you into trouble with the town. 4) You can have firewood, but again, no fireplace. So you need some other way to burn it.
So the question is what would be the most practical way to prepare for this. I live in Houston and don't worry much about keeping warm (although it can get quite cold here in winter). I have lots of flashlights, batteries, gasoline/propane-powered lanterns, gasoline/propane powered stoves, even a portable propane-powered water heater (works great), along with electric and natural gas water heaters. I also have the ability to collect and purify rain water.
What I don't have is a way to keep warm if the temperature dropped to 10 degrees here (which it won't, but which it does in the Northeast).
So, any ideas? I would want the system used to keep warm to be the following: 1) Non-intrusive. In other words, not immediately noticeable if it's not in use. So something that can be deployed reasonably easy. 2) If combustion is used (as likely the case), then a way to safely vent combustion gasses, while keeping as much heat as possible indoors
Any suggestions are welcome, and thanks all!
Understand. In that situation, just let the water go, I’m with you. Neat idea!!
Nice looking lamps, what do they run on?
“The area around a person inside an igloo is around 60 degrees. I’d basically build an indoor igloo for a sleeping area with polystyrene sheets and aluminum foil for reflection of radiant heat.”
Good idea. That’s basically my post-hurricane concept also - build a small room in my garage out of styrofoam, and then run an air conditioner inside of it. Can’t see why that wouldn’t work in winter.
Someone I was worried about, in the dark suburbs alone, has turned out to be somewhat of a secret prepper. When last heard from, she was sitting before her gas heater, having just made lamb chops on her gas grill, wearing a headlamp and reading, with her battery-powered radio nearby. Earlier she had gone for a two-hour walk with her neighborhood walking group. People nearby with generators had asked her to stay with them, but thanks but no thanks.
“Btw, great post. The ability to keep warm is something most people don’t consider. Cold kills hundreds yearly and we seem to be entering a time of colder weather.”
Thanks. I spent a couple of days trying to figure out what could be done if I were out there. This subject certainly beats complaining about Romney trying to win with a pre-vent defense.
“So here’s the scenario, and assume this is well before the hurricane has hit...so there’s plenty of time to buy supplies and equipment”
First rule of surviving a bad situation: don’t be there.
In this case, the warning time was measured in days, if not years.
“Someone I was worried about, in the dark suburbs alone, has turned out to be somewhat of a secret prepper. When last heard from, she was sitting before her gas heater, having just made lamb chops on her gas grill, wearing a headlamp and reading, with her battery-powered radio nearby. Earlier she had gone for a two-hour walk with her neighborhood walking group. People nearby with generators had asked her to stay with them, but thanks but no thanks.”
SWEET!! Most people just think they’re prepped enough - she obviously thought it out before that day came.
“First rule of surviving a bad situation: don’t be there. In this case, the warning time was measured in days, if not years.”
We know where “there” is, but do we know where we can live that doesn’t have its own threats? Think about areas of the country, and there is almost always a real threat, from something. Near St. Louis, for example, they have to worry about an earthquake that would be larger than any ever recorded (the last big one there rang church bells in Boston).
Thanks very much for all the great ideas. Here’s what I think is a good approach, followed by many of the other suggestions:
Get a Mr. Heater Big Buddy or equivalent (18,000 BTU propane space heater) and have several 20 pound (or larger) propane tanks (the heater is good for about 4 days per tank). Then buy the necessary hoses to operate the heater from larger tanks - verify proper operation before “it” happens. Identify a well insulated room, but with a window that can still be opened for ventilation (or the heater will deplete the Oxygen) and only operate while awake. Finally, have a battery-powered Carbon Monoxide detector available, with enough spare batteries. At that point, you have a safe way to stay warm.
Your post reminds me of one of my favorite movies - Alone in the Wilderness - Dick Proeneke. I’ve watched it more than a dozen times.
I own the movie. I watch it regularly.
One of the reasons I'd like to see the parts that didn't hit the film is because living like that is somewhat different in the telling than in the living. Sure. I made it. I'll tell some parts of it.
The day the dogs ran a cougar in front of the slit trench where I was squatting? There are details to that story that will never get told.
If you lived, you learned. ;)
/johnny
No. Get a separate one. Worth its weight in gold. I am in dark but it gives ne warmth, warm water, and a stove top. It heats the entire house very cheaply. Take drive to NW Jersey. Firewood really cheap.
ping to useful information thread
We were without power for three days during sandy, and routinely lose power during storms as we live in a very wooded area. In some ways losing power is easier to deal with when the weather is cooler. I find it very difficult to sleep with no AC.
Anyway... We don’t have a generator, but we do have some easy to use power inverters that plug into the cars cig lighters. Our inverters can have 2 electric cords plugged in and even have a USB port.
That means all of our various electric media can be run.
As our cable/Internet usually goes out of commission during storms I have added a tethering plan to my phone so we can at
Least watch Netflix and browse the Internet.
My ranch house has four working fireplaces so as long as we have firewood, we can stay warm. We are on a well which requires electricity to
Work, so we fill buckets before the power goes out, and always keep extra bottled water on hand.
Most importantly I keep loads of sterno cooking fuel on hand. I have servingware for parties which is perfect for heating soup/stew or other types of food. I also have some pots that fit over the servingware holders, and have even made coffee with a stove top espresso pot over the sterno heat.
Oh... And batteries and flashlights..... And cheap candles
From the dollar store.
In general we always get warnings before bad weather is upon us... So theres little excuse for not being prepared.
IMO it does. Could it just be feel good juice? I have to say perhaps..
I've read that today's unleaded will begin going bad in as little as a week. The real question is what does "going bad" mean? I've seen unleaded gas sit in junk cars for years and you can still get them started on it; a summer ritual around here when building your derby cars.
My understanding is sta-bil puts a thin coat of oil over the exposed gas in a tank and effectively seals it. I put it in every time I store gas. Even in my lawnmower jug when I bring it home freshly filled. I also run a dose of Sea Foam through all of my small motors once a year (and derby cars) to give them a "chemical" tune; removes varnish from the carb and jets.
Biggest enemy you have to storing gas anymore is the damn ethanol. Alcohol draws moisture. Ethanol for preps is best stored in half gallon bottles! :)
Nice, but a bit light in my opinion. For example, for water storage, I have 4 (at least) 30 gallon trash cans. Before a hurricane in put in a double-liner of the heavy duty Hefty trash bags they sell at Home Depot (in the yellow boxes), then simply fill them up to about 25 gallons (with a hose), and then seal the bags on top. We tested it after Hurricane Ike and the first trash can lasted a week. A very efficient way to store water. Emptying them can be a pain (if you wind up not needing the water), but you can siphon or scoop out the water.
Your power system isn’t bad. Similar to mine - multiple inverters, run off a car. I also have a very small gasoline generator that I’d use for that purpose, but haven’t even opened up yet. I think the generator can be more efficient, but I’m not sure. Still, the inverter approach is good if you have full tanks in your vehicles and don’t need to drive much - very convenient. Yes, sleeping in a hot house is tough, but spending day after day trying to find gasoline isn’t much fun either...so I’m with you, let that go.
Four fireplaces is great...so that part is taken care of. Sterno is good idea...but very expensive in the long term. It appears to have about half of the energy content of gasoline (it’s 67% ethanol). As a rough estimate, using the Amazon price and the energy content, Sterno cost about $85 per gallon - for the equivalent energy of a gallon of gasoline. Having said that, one gallon of gasoline, used for cooking, goes a very, very, long way. Also, Sterno will store forever (as far as I know)...so it still has a place, but if you’re boiling mac and cheese, it’s an expensive way to cook. But if you’re warming up soup, for example, it’s not a bad way to go, at all.
Dollar store candles make a lot of sense too. I bought out a store once, and calculated the energy cost at half the cost of gasoline - if they’re big fat candles for 50 cents, you’re doing very well there.
You can evaluate the threats, and leave or prepare accordingly well in advance. The scenario at hand is ocean-proximate hurricane wind & water damage, so long before you can move well above storm surge & runoff levels, harden structures, stock supplies, and reconsider moving to somewhere far from such problems. NYC had plenty of warning, so people could have left outright. St. Louis? you know, so no excuses if caught off guard.
I only discovered it 6 or 7 years ago so when I say I’ve watched it at least a dozen times that is a lot for me. Yes there are some bad edits in it. Also found some You tubes, people who’ve visited the cabin in more recent times. I am always amazed at the end when they say how long he lived there and his age. He was made of tough stuff and that is inspiring.
Ours looks something like this only wider...
Ours looks something like this only wider...
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