Posted on 05/27/2012 5:48:19 AM PDT by FLAMING DEATH
I was cautious, I bought a box of 20 rounds to test the Tula. I had to manually feed or eject every third round. Thankfully no serious jams.
I have no intention of ever putting that stuff in mine again.
It seems that the Russian stuff is not loaded as hot as most brass. Sounds like it didn’t have enough “oomph” to work the action of your gun. I’ve heard of that happening before.
Some ARs run it fine out of the box, some require some experimentation, like mine. Some just won’t run it.
Unfortunately, I bought a metric sh**-ton of the stuff before I tested it, so I was relieved that I could make it work. It’s great for plinking...and practicing stoppage drills!
Interesting article, thanks for posting it.
My reason for not firing steel cases in an AR (borrowed, of course, as mine got lost in a boating accident) is that it is very hard on the extractor. I don’t want to have to buy (a friend) a new extractor just to save a few bucks on ammo and, of course, you don’t want to have it crap out just when you need it to work or you take a dirt nap.
Perhaps, though, the reason it is hard on extractors is the crud build-up?
Steel cases have another problem besides expansion. They are hard and cause chamber damage. If any edge exists at the bullet crimp, it acts like a chisel on the edge of the chamber when it feeds in. This is especially bad in pistols due to the angle of incidence on the chamber wall and generally higher number of rounds fired.
Problem solved - don't keep running crap ammo and expect different results!
I have a S&W M&P 15R (5.45x39). In that caliber, my only choice is Russian steel-cased ammo. Fortunately, I’ve only had to knock out a stuck case just once in 2000 rounds of use.
It might be hard on the extractor. I’ve heard both sides. Probably because the increased friction with the chamber walls due to buildup makes it harder for the extractor to pull the round out.
I just keep an extra extractor handy, which is a good idea no matter what kind of ammo you use. It’s a 10 minute fix and the extractor is cheap. You can get a DPMS extractor for around $13.
As for the hardness of the casing, it is harder than brass, but still very mild steel, and is far less hard than your chamber. If you think about it, people who run steel case exclusively in AK type rifles don’t seem to have a problem with chamber damage. If I had to guess, I’d say that the steel they use in Yugo, Romanian or even Russian AK rifles probably isn’t as high quality as that used in most ARs and many of those rifles digest steel their whole lives without issue. I have an old SKS (borrowed of course) that I’ve run for literally decades on nothing but steel and haven’t noticed any chamber damage.
Yeah, Tula and Wolf are crap ammo...but anything that lets me practice more for less is worth it.
It’s a useful article, thank you for posting!
makes sense. i have found that the steel stuff runs fine out of my chrome lined ARs, but it does have issues in standard.
My buddy’s wife has an M4 that can fire 100 round Beta mags of steel .223 without a hitch.
It all depends on the gun. Of course, the 5.45x39 has a more tapered case, too, which helps.
Mine has a chrome lined barrel, but the chamber is not.
Mixing the brass with the steel fixed the extraction problem completely, at least for the first 150 rounds or so. I’ll keep testing though.
I had Silver Bear hang up in my chamber as well. But, when I did this test, I was using Tula (well, it was Herter’s from Cabelas, but if you read the box, it is Tula).
Before I mixed in the brass, I couldn’t get 50 rounds through the gun without a stoppage that required tools to fix.
I think there’s a lot of variation from gun to gun, esp. considering that many “homemade” AR’s are pieced together from parts originating from many different sources and it is hard to tell what parts have what effects on the feeding/firing/extracting process. It’s good to have a resource like AR15.com to use as a starting point for your own experimentation to see what works best in your gun.
Anything that gives me a reason to shoot more is a good thing.
Thanks all for the good info. I have run fair amount of Ruski steel through 45 ACP, not many apparent problems, but like anything else if its too good to be true (low cost plinking) it probably is. Sure don’t want to turn a fat pistola into a trotline weight.
Thinking about it, I would never buy chinese ammo, why ruski??? Both’s price edge is from dropping quality.
Quite an interesting article. I have purchased Wolf before and have only one box remaining. Never had a problem with chambering/extracting but the round-to-round dispersion was horrendous. Having done my own re-loading, I could only conclude that Wolf does not have any quality control WRT grain load. This could also be a factor in the extracting.
IMHO, minor variations in chamber dimensions can make a huge difference.
My Bushmaster M-4gery can digest a thousand rounds of steel ammo no problem with no cleaning.
A friend’s Olympic AR could not get through a magazine without a jam, even though it works perfectly with brass ammo.
Yeah. I plan to keep shooting to see when the first hang-up occurs. I’ll report back when I have more info.
And, I don’t think this would have worked nearly as well if I hadn’t started with a clean chamber. I did NOT clean after the last range session, however, as I plan to pick up where I’ve left off. I have a few more boxes of Tula to put through before I clean.
I’ll let you know!
Mark For Later...
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