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To: DiogenesLamp

DiogenesLamp wrote: “The Word ‘Nation’ is derived from the same root as ‘Natal’ (meaning of birth) and it has nothing to do with dirt.”

True. What’s more, the word “natural” goes back to the same origin, by way of the Latin ‘naturalis’, meaning “by birth, according to nature”.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=natural

The etymology is yet more evidence that “Natural-born” means by and from birth. The term references neither place nor parentage; only birth itself. “Natural-born United States citizen” means a United States citizen who became a United States citizen at the moment of his or her birth. [Paraphrased from United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)]


122 posted on 12/01/2011 1:23:31 AM PST by BladeBryan
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To: BladeBryan
But KWA and Mr. Obama needed the 14th Amendment. Without the 14th amendment, Mr. Obama is a British and then Kenyan citizen. Just as KWA was a Chinese citizen without the 14th.

Virginia Minor did not need the 14th. Presidents did not need the 14th until Obama was elected. But, the problem is, the NBC clause was never amended. We added the 14th to naturalize children of immigrants. This is why Obama has had several legal citizenships. He needed naturalization. This is why our own government couldn't figure out if he was a citizen when he came back from Indonesia.

Mr. Obama is an example of a Cluster-Fluck of citizenships.

129 posted on 12/01/2011 5:42:33 AM PST by PA-RIVER
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To: BladeBryan
True. What’s more, the word “natural” goes back to the same origin, by way of the Latin ‘naturalis’, meaning “by birth, according to nature”. http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=natural

It doesn't mean by "circumstances of birth", it means genetically by birth. Did you not see the related word Gnasci i.e. Genus? "Partus sequitur Patrem" dude.

The etymology is yet more evidence that “Natural-born” means by and from birth. The term references neither place nor parentage; only birth itself. “Natural-born United States citizen” means a United States citizen who became a United States citizen at the moment of his or her birth. [Paraphrased from United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)]

You need to dig deeper. Natural, Nature, and Naturalis are not referring to location, but to characteristics inherent in the organism. You will not make a Giraffe into a Crocodile by birthing it in the swamp.

136 posted on 12/01/2011 6:34:43 AM PST by DiogenesLamp (Partus sequitur Patrem)
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To: BladeBryan

BladeBryan wrote: “What’s more, the word “natural” goes back to the same origin, by way of the Latin ‘naturalis’, meaning “by birth, according to nature”.”

That is completely INCORRECT. If the term ‘natural’ was to bean ‘since birth’ as you say - then ‘natural born’ is redundant, and makes no sense.

There are 2 types of laws - positive law, which are those created by man, such as the Constitution, and laws originating in the legislature - and NATURAL LAW, which is the laws of nature or the Divine.

The founders referred to natural law often, an example is in the Declaration when they mention “unalienable Rights”.

The term is ‘natural born Citizen’. Notice the ‘C’ is capitalized. They did this to show that it is a proper noun. That means that ‘natural’, and ‘born’ are adjectives. ‘Born’ means exactly what you would think = since birth. ‘Natural’ means exactly what it says, through ‘natural law’.

The term ‘natural born Citizen’ means - a US citizen, as defined by the laws of nature, from the time of birth.


138 posted on 12/01/2011 6:50:26 AM PST by MMaschin
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