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Radiation in Japan: Nosebleed, Diarrhea, Lack of Energy in Children in Koriyama City, Fukushima
ex-skf.blogspot.com ^ | 6/16/2011 | Ex-SKF

Posted on 06/16/2011 11:51:15 AM PDT by ransomnote

Once a malicious "baseless rumor" on the net, now it is written up in a regional newspaper with readership in Tokyo and Kanto area.

Tokyo Shinbun (paper edition only, 6/16/2011) reports that many children in Koriyama City in Fukushima Prefecture, 50 kilometers from Fukushima I Nuclear Power Plant, are suffering inexplicable nosebleed, diarrhea, and lack of energy since the nuke plant accident. Quick translation of the article:

What's happening to children in Koriyama City in Fukushima right now? Nosebleed, diarrhea, lack of energy - "Effect of radiation unknown" says the doctor

Report by Ao Ideta, Tokyo Shinbun, June 16, 2011

On June 12, a non-profit organization called "The Bridge to Chernobyl" (チェルノブイリへのかけはし) held a free clinic in Koriyama City in Fukushima Prefecture, 50 kilometers [west] from Fukushima I Nuclear Power Plant.

Worried about the effect of radiation exposure, 50 families brought their children to see the doctor.

A 39-year-old mother of two told the doctor that her 6-year-old daughter had nosebleed everyday for 3 weeks in April. For 1 week, the daughter bled copiously from both nostrils. The mother said their doctor told her it was just a seasonal allergy from pollen. Her other child, 2-year-old son, had nosebleed from end of April to May.

(Excerpt) Read more at ex-skf.blogspot.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: fukushima; fukushimachildren; japan; radiation
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To: little jeremiah

I liked this quote from the Ex-Skf blogger describing pro nuke priests:

Then again, as one of my Twitter followers reminded me, “Radiation is rumor; safety is religion; ignorance is strength.”


61 posted on 06/16/2011 9:29:28 PM PDT by ransomnote
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To: justa-hairyape

The current nuke priests remind me nostalgically of the March/April nuke priests. Remember when they mocked, sneered, laughed at anyone so ‘ignorant’ as to believe that the situation was well in hand and any concern on our part was ‘fear mongering’ (sigh - yeah - good times). And every time RummyChick posted something that wounded their nuke religious sensitivities, how they screamed she was ‘hysterical’? (those were the days!) Then when Japan grudgingly admitted that there was ONE core melt down, how the priests began to huddle. Then the embarrassed admission that well, yeah, all three had melt downs? Remember the silence? Crickets? Not a pro nuke priest to be found. (really takes me back)
Now, after an embarrassed lull, they are back but I have to say they are running out of ideas - it’s kinda repetitive now and the usual condescension is there along with the demand for credentials to post articles about other expert opinions and news reports and all but...well their arguments are pure sophistry tackling the reporters take on the issue rather than the issue, and the distortions and exaggerations - well it’s like pinning jello to a wall now more then ever. (Boy though - even from the start, RummyChick really could pin ‘em, couldn’t she, and she made it look easy). Well, that was just my stroll down memory lane. See on the next thread.


62 posted on 06/16/2011 9:38:55 PM PDT by ransomnote
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To: little jeremiah

Well, they have been dealing with Cesium in milk, and feeding their cattle boron to combat it, and that must be coming from Fukushima too so yeah, I’d say it was probably Fukushima. Thanks for posting the link, I’ll go read the whole article.


63 posted on 06/16/2011 9:43:01 PM PDT by ransomnote
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To: ransomnote

I’m sorry, do you think that Fukishuma is actually a dozen failed power plants? I mean, we all know that there are 4 reactors at the Fukishima plant, but nobody has yet claimed that the radiation has mutated the plant into replicant plants spreading over the country.

Frankly, commenting in these threads is all a waste of time. Most freepers are too smart to fall for the anti-nuclear hysteria, so it’s not even like it’s important to correct the misinformation.

I just think it’s fun to comment on the articles posted. I’m not really trying to win a nobel prize or anything.

And with others on the thread plugging their ears, shouting “nyah nyah nyah I can’t hear you” when someone posts things they don’t like, I’m hardly expecting to change the minds of the people who believe this stuff.


64 posted on 06/16/2011 9:43:24 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: ransomnote

I think I saw one of the cores competing on the “American Ninja” show. Yes, they have escaped, and they are running around the country even as we speak.

That kind of thing doesn’t happen in our country, where we have a much better criminal justice system — unless of course they were illegal immigrant cores sneaking in from Mexico.

On the other hand, I can’t find “very hot” on my thermostat. Maybe you could explain exactly what temperature that is; if numbers aren’t available, you could put them on a scale between “I stuck my tongue to a dry ice block” and “But I had to reach into the molten steel vat, I dropped my ring and my wife would kill me”.

No, seriously. Unit 1 is at 100-120 degrees centigrade — hot enough to create steam, but not to cook steak.

Unit two is 108 degrees at the feed, again hot but not terribly so.

Unit three is about 170 degrees — that’s a bit hotter, and might ignite really flammable paper.

None of those are hot enough to melt through anything. But I presume you knew that, and you are talking about something that melted a while ago.

None of them have “escaped containment” in the meaningful sense (in that they are still cooled by pumping water into the containment, which would be useless if the cores weren’t still there). There have been reports of either holes in containment or in the pipes connecting to containment that are allowing radiated steam to escape, and some people believe melted fuel has actually gotten out of the main vessel and is now in the containment area (which obviously isn’t “escaped containment” which would mean it melted through the concrete floor, something nobody serious has been claiming so far as I can tell).

Of course, some of the cores “escaped” when they were removed and put into the uncontained fuel pools. Although that’s an odd use of the word “escaped”.


65 posted on 06/16/2011 10:03:39 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: ransomnote

Your comments are a pleasure to read. A bitter pleasure, because the truth is bitter; but bitter truth is always preferable to cyanide lies doctored with saccharine.


66 posted on 06/16/2011 10:04:23 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: ransomnote
I never stopped talking about the facts and ridiculing rampant and unsubstantiated speculation.

You could read this: Latest Status Fukushima Plants

Of course, that's from the evil TEPCO.

67 posted on 06/16/2011 10:06:04 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: ransomnote
IAEA Fukushima Nuclear Accident Update Log:

IAEA Preliminary Report (pdf)

The main preliminary findings and lessons learned are:

• The Japanese Government, nuclear regulators and operators have been extremely open in sharing information and answering the many questions of the mission to assist the world in learning lessons to improve nuclear safety.

• The response on the site by dedicated, determined and expert staff, under extremely arduous conditions has been exemplary and resulted in the best approach to securing safety given the exceptional circumstances. This has been greatly assisted by highly professional back-up support, especially the arrangements at J-Village to secure the protection of workers going on sites.

• The Japanese Government’s longer term response to protect the public, including evacuation, has been impressive and extremely well organized. A suitable and timely follow-up programme on public and worker exposures and health monitoring would be beneficial.

Of course, all the official sources, and all the government entities, and all the people who are trained and paid to worry about stuff like this, are all in on the conspiracy, and we should instead look to internet blogs for the "real story".
68 posted on 06/16/2011 10:15:11 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: little jeremiah

It’s also a lot easier if you just read the stuff you agree with, and avert your eyes from the rest.


69 posted on 06/16/2011 10:16:06 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: little jeremiah

If you live in Hawaii, you should wrap yourself in aluminum foil and hide under your bed, so you don’t get irradiated by those 100+ counts-per-minute bursts of high-intensity radiation.


70 posted on 06/16/2011 10:18:20 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: ransomnote; Del Rapier

I think that will be added to the list of hysterical, apocolyptic claims. “strange people”? three-headed? 4-legged? eyes in the back of their head? Like a Simpsons episode?


71 posted on 06/16/2011 10:21:25 PM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: CharlesWayneCT

You cite the IAEA? You know that Gorbachev authorized his officer to go to the IAEA and report how much exposure/radiation was released from Chernobyl? And at the conclusion of that report, the IAEA sat in shocked, stunned silence...before deciding to accept as ‘official’ only one tenth of the radiation just reported live by the Russian officer? Hans Blix is on tape explaining why they made that decision so it’s not like it didn’t happen.
The IAEA’s mission is to support and promote the civilian use of nuclear power. The whitewash report you cited was very valuable to the Japanese gov and TEPCO PR effort and infuriated those citizens trying to get any information or help out of their government or TEPCO. What did you expect? That the IAEA would admit the gravity of the deception and the prognosis for the future? THAT won’t get any power plants built!


72 posted on 06/16/2011 10:24:31 PM PDT by ransomnote
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To: CharlesWayneCT; Del Rapier

Run along to bed, Charles, the adults are talking and it’s past your bedtime. He commented dryly, and I and the other adults understood him.


73 posted on 06/16/2011 10:26:49 PM PDT by ransomnote
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To: CharlesWayneCT

You’re one of the strangest nutcases on FR.

I’m sure that very few people read the strange dislocated nonsense you randomly type; I certainly don’t.


74 posted on 06/16/2011 10:44:05 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: ransomnote

To me, the crimes of the Soviets are a spectrum that starts with Lenin and the October Revolution and run clear through the early 90’s. Stalin is but one chapter, a particularly savage chapter, in the Soviet system.

People in the US in the 80’s were silly (or stupid) enough to think that Ol’ Splotch-Top was a new kind of leader, kinder, gentler, cuddlier sort of communist. Well, ask the people of Afghanistan about that. It wasn’t because the Soviets were doing an imitation of a Fuller Brush salesman that we backed the Muj in Afghanistan and started the mess that has sort of boomeranged on us in Osama bin Laden.

As for the robots: No effort seems to have been made to determine what the level of radiation was on the roof project. None. The level of ionizing radiation required to make electronics (ie, solid state electronics) malfunction is huge. No one seemed to want to honestly put 2+2 together and say “Golly, that’s sorta like 4, huh?” or “Golly, it takes one hell of a lot of ionizing radiation to make solid state electronics malfunction... so let’s get some equipment up here and *measure it*.”

As I said, no effort was made. Any engineer worth his beer would have said “Hmmm. Golly, why has more than one robot or remote operated device failed here? Can someone get me a reading on the actual, you know, *level* of ionizing radiation here?” No, instead, let’s go call up the reservists, have them make lead-sheet suits to feel better about it, and send them marching out there.

In hindsight, some people reckon the radiation levels on the roof project was in excess of 2 C/kg. Well, golly... in light of charge levels like that, little wonder the electronics malfunctioned. The solution to that is to not use electronics. Duuuuuh. I’m a EE, and if you give me that sort of operating environment (which would require measuring the radiation levels first), I’d say “Don’t call me, go talk to that MechE over there, and ask around to start getting a whole lot of hydraulic hoses, valves and pumps” - stuff that wouldn’t be affected by that level of ionizing radiation. All that was needed was to take some readings before throwing up one’s hands in disgust and puzzlement as to why the electronics were malfunctioning. If they’d taken said readings, they’d have known that sending men out there was even more absurd.

The Soviets called up 10,000 miners (not members of the Army, but miners - who were given no choices in the matter) to dig a tunnel under the mess, to allow them to install a cooling plant. After the miners worked like sled dogs... the Soviets didn’t install the cooling plant. Instead, they put some concrete into the chamber below the reactor core. Examples like this abound in the Chernobyl story. Utterly feckless, bureaucratic, totalitarian incompetence was the order of the day.

The entombment over Chernobyl wasn’t fully closed for years. They had holes of 1 to 10 square meters in the structure; it was never built to be air or water tight. It was a fast-n-dirty operation, more evidence of a management and political team that had no clue what they were doing. They dumped in sand, boron, lead (what a winning idea there...) on top of the fire.

It still isn’t “sealed,” and the structure actually needs to be replaced. No one appears interested in paying for it, least of all the Ukraine or Russia. Fortunately, just as in TMI and other reactor core meltdowns, the much-ballyhoo’ed meltdown to China (or where ever is on the other side of the globe) never happened. In all instances, the core melted, slumped only so far (in Chernobyl’s case, into the floor below) and it cooled and sat there. Radioactive as all hell, sure, but a China Syndrome? Nope.

Compared to Chernobyl, so far the Japanese have been an order of magnitude less inept. Citing “reactors with 40 times more fuel” is like comparing apples and oranges. A two-stage weapon has far less fuel in it than a power reactor. I’d rather have a faulty power reactor next door than a faulty weapon in storage next door for obvious reasons.

Have the Japanese got a mess on their hands? Of course they do. I’ve said before and I’ll say again, that I think the cleanup costs on this could run as high as $300B. But these constant cynical calls of “they lie!” are getting just a little silly. They’ve got a complicated, highly dynamic situation on their hands, and the clowns in the media have the math and physics IQ of a fluffy rabbit. Add to this the tendency for the lesser technical talents to rise in management, and there’s plenty of potential for mis-statement and false data in the press.

When I look back on the footage of actual work on Chernobyl and then I look at TEPCO’s recent status reports:

http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/press/corp-com/release/betu11_e/images/110617e4.pdf

There’s simply no comparison. Anyone who thinks there is is simply full of crap. NISA is warning TEPCO when they have two (count them, *two*) workers with detected exposures above 250 mSv. Tens of thousands of Chernobyl guys have *no* idea how much exposure they got. The Soviets never thought to do measurements. The workers didn’t have proper respirators until late in the game, they didn’t have proper dosimeters, monitoring equipment, etc. The Soviets just blundered their way through the whole thing with brute force.

The IAEA report (now available as of 07 June) makes for interesting reading. I suggest you go read it.


75 posted on 06/17/2011 3:29:22 AM PDT by NVDave
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To: NVDave
No, you fool! The IAEA cannot be trusted. The Japanese government cannot be trusted. Anybody with a nuclear degree cannot be trusted -- they are all dependent on, and in the pockets of, the nuclear industry.

There is only one man we can trust, who stands for all that is good and right and just; one man we can turn to for the real information. Stop relying on pesky experts; use the blogs, and receive the wisdom of:

UltraMan - EX-SKF!!!

76 posted on 06/17/2011 9:08:09 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: NVDave

Some of what you say is true (e.g. 10,000 miners) and some of what you say is not (they made no attempt to measure the radiation on the roof) and some of what you say is irrelevant (they deduced that they wouldn’t be able to use machines on the roof due to radiation - they didn’t scratch their heads and wonder. The point was they realized they couldn’t use machines.)
I think the Soviet response was brutal and it still left 1.6 million people living in contaminated zones in ‘86. Highly radioactive mushrooms were just halted at the UK border last week - still heavy contamination showing up 26 years after Chernobyl.
But TEPCO asked to abandon Fukushima. The only ones able to do anything to spare their country and the rest of the world from 3 core melt downs and 4 spent fuel pool melts asked to abandon ship. The brutal Soviet response was a wild bid to save the ship - and partially worked to spare the people so much more damage. TEPCO and the face saving Government response is to cover their backsides and downplay the dangers and is presently on course to do so much more damage. Hope they rethink their strategy.
Oh and they do lie, and their own people are tired of it, and for the first time in their culture, a protest movement is brewing. TEPCO, the Japanese Government, the IAEA have one common goal - to promote nuclear power at all costs. You have the same goal. Why would anyone who knew how the IAEA performed re Chernobyl bother to read their ‘report’ on Fukushima? When the Japanese heard that the IAEA was sending a delegation, a blogger acquired the names of the delegates from various countries and asked readers to contribute anything known about them to see if this was real help being offered or if it was a PR effort. You can imagine their disappointment to learn from collected excerpts from IAEA and related websites that the delegates were PR.
Say, why is it that no insurance company would ever consider insuring a nuclear plant? Don’t bother replying - I know the answer.


77 posted on 06/17/2011 11:08:40 AM PDT by ransomnote
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To: CharlesWayneCT

Yea, another financial know-it-all trader. Just like the snot-nosed twerps on ZeroHedge.

Yea, I run into these little know-it-all twerps on financial web sites all the time. They’re the ultimate bloggers from their mommy’s basement, sitting at home, playing pachinko in the day trader’s markets. The reality of these dribblers is that most of them have never created or done anything tangible in their lives.


78 posted on 06/17/2011 12:46:40 PM PDT by NVDave
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To: ransomnote

You ascribe to me the goal of “promoting nuclear power at all costs.”

Yea, right. You’re another idiot conspiracy theorist, and I’m in on the conspiracy. Jesus, I get tired of you clowns.

So, lemme ask you this: Do you believe that we didn’t land on the moon? That Apollo 11 was a Hollywood back-lot job? Of course you do. The government lies. All the time. About everything.


79 posted on 06/17/2011 12:51:26 PM PDT by NVDave
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To: NVDave

We landed on the moon. Apollo 11 was not a farce.

In our exchange, you spend sufficient time and venom supporting Japan, Tepco and the IAEA (all of whom have a stated goal of supporting nuclear energy) and when told of the negative ramifications of their decisions - you say nothing. I take that to mean the costs are, to you, negligible, and that you focus your energy on trying to silence those of us who are presently discussing the costs: Fukushima


80 posted on 06/17/2011 12:55:56 PM PDT by ransomnote
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