Posted on 03/17/2011 7:01:30 AM PDT by maggief
Oh, dear God.
The Galicians were in GAUL which is now France.
The Iberians were in, naturally, Iberia, which is now Spain.
Now, go look at a -map- and tell me the flaws in your “migratory logic”.
They technically speak a modernized “P.I.E.” which is proto-Indo-European language.
To all anthropologists, the -language- *is* the biggest unifying factor in what we now call “Celts”, religion coming in a close second.
That’s it.
I’m not pitting 30 years of studying this stuff against somebody Googling fragments and [incorrectly] cobbling them together.
[”Eastern Celtic language”?!? WTH?]
*sheesh*
Mind the Ps and Qs, for the LAST time.
The only way my hair will EVER get cut is post-mortem.
[and thanks]...:)
My mom hates it.
Her: “How long are you going to let your hair keep growing?”
Me: “Until it’s done.”
“Remember, if you go back 5 generations, you will find 32 ancestors, and only one of them is likely to have the same surname as you.”
Um, I’ve not mentioned that I’m an Appalachian hillbilly, have I?
All statistical bets are off.
LOL!
The Bible says that a woman’s hair is her crowning glory.
Should I spit in God’s face?
I think not...:]
Wow.
You sound *gorgeous*....:D
I’m Ulster/Scots/Danish/Welsh with a smidgen of Austro-Hungarian tossed in just for flavor.
My Scots/Danish mom is hulking Valkyrie with dark blond hair and gray eyes.
I took after the tiny Welsh kin...LOL
RE Photo:
It’s...it’s just...heartbreaking...SERIOUS junk in the trunk...
That was Julius Caesar's Day and he was only talking about "the Gaul" that stretched from Gascony, North of the Greek colonies along the Rhone, and up to the Fenns of the Low Country, and East to the Rhine. Way back when the Carthaginians were beating up on the Romans, Magolis (McWallace) was running darned near all of Iberia ~ and he was allied to Carthage. He was certainly a Galician, and not what is called an Celt-Iberian.
THE primary group of Celtic languages that lasted from the most ancient times we have recorded, which is 2700 years before the present time, ALL derive from the exact same group of Celtic languages known along the Danube all the way back to the Kingdom of David.
They had a dust up according to the Greeks and they relocated ~ a common thing in ancient times (as it is now).
They did not chop their way West through the primitive wilderness of late bronze age / early iron age Europe. They sailed into the Mediterranean and engaged in commerce. Then they chopped their way around the Pillars of Hercules on up past the Light House at Brigantia and then took over existing primitive societies.
After some length of time (a few generations), they'd built their strenth and the Sons of Ir, who worshipped the Great Goddess Scota landed in the place we call ireland and conquered it. Then others of their group landed in Britain and conquered it.
Hundreds of years later the Romans arrived in Britain ~ 30 AD. Let's hop back to 700 BC ~ Galicia existed (according to modern Galicians) and even sported one of the oldest, if not THE oldest lighthouses on the planet.
Today they enter the international bagpipe contests with the Bagoud ~ check 'em out on the Net.
There are some other names that've been given to the North Coast of the iberian peninsula.
When King San Cho Noe set about organizing the Christian kingdoms in the North to begin the big push against the Moslems in the 700/800 period, he named them Castile, Leon and Carvajal. That latter place, Carvajal, was pretty much what had been known as Galicia for a very long time before ~ running off into that period before the memory of man could recall.
You can think Galicia was Gaul, or that it was in Gaul, but it was on the Bay of Biscay, just west of the Basque Country in Iberia, this side of the Pyrenees.
You can go back 4 generations in any direction and pick up the same surnames ~ sometimes ALL of them the same eh!
Those different ways of spelling McDonald/McDonnell/Dunn/(etc ~ huge list of 'em) don't fool me!
HOW can you trace someones "roots" when one knows virtually NOTHING about them, including, beyond any shadow of a doubt, where they were born?
Few, as of now, know who he really is and those that do may not be telling. He certainly seems anything but American born and bred. What has the possibility of shedding light on who he really is would be a genetic analysis comparing his genetic profile to all those now called his relatives and those who may be suspected to be his real relatives. Does anyone have access to any of his hair, saliva or such as to get this study started? It would be good if he is who he says he is if he would volunteer to have his genetic profile checked in to.
I would also be interested in knowing for sure that he is an actual black African man as many in the world may be very dark and have similar features to his but not be out of Africa. He probably is African black but I don't fully trust anything that is suppose to be true about him without verification.
“known along the Danube all the way back to the Kingdom of David.”
What are you?
One of those loony “British Israelites” kooks?
WTH does King David have to do with *anything*?
Do you believe the Stone of Scone is actually “Jacob’s pillow”?
“After some length of time (a few generations), they’d built their strenth and the Sons of Ir, who worshipped the Great Goddess Scota”
The silly crap about “Scota” is just that, *crap*.
Sine we’re gonna play “history according to Google”, here’s the very concise and correct information from wiki:
Scotland is derived from the Latin Scoti, the term applied to Gaels, people from what is now Scotland and Ireland, and the Dal Riada who had come from Ireland to reside in the Northwest of what is now Scotland, in contrast, for example, to the Picts.
Accordingly, the Late Latin word Scotia (land of the Gaels) was initially used to refer to Ireland.
However, by the 11th century at the latest, Scotia was being used to refer to (Gaelic-speaking) Scotland north of the river Forth, alongside Albania or Albany, both derived from the Gaelic Alba.
The use of the words Scots and Scotland to encompass all of what is now Scotland became common in the Late Middle Ages.”
There *was* no “Queen Scota”, an Egyptian, a “fairy queen” or otherwise.
Are you buying your “history” books in Borders’ “magick” section or what?
Just for kicks, tell me who the Galatians were.
[if that stumps you utterly, here’s a nice, *short* “Cliff Notes” version” http://history-world.org/celts.htm ]
It astonishes me that you’re so fixated on the Danube river.
How long did it take you to Google their connection their the Rhone, the Rhine [but missing] the Seine?
Until then, go play here:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/711000/posts
FYI, my “Austro-Hungarian” kin came from *Salzburg*.
Ring any incredibly relevant bells?
Didn’t think so.
[and neither does “Urnfield, Hallsatt, la Tienne or the Beaker People, probably]
“British Isrealism.”
Bah!
You still have *not* addressed the incredibly important significance of P-Celtic versus Q-Celtic.
Why?
Is Google down for the evening?
Are you even aware that the IRISH invented the bag pipes?
They were originally called Uilean pipes are much more beautiful sounding than the modern “Scottish” bagpipes.
I will be reformatting this laptop tonight [new hard drive] and even if I weren’t I will *not* be wasting any more time on you and your bizarre myths disguised as “history”.
“Queen Scota and the sons of Ir”.
LMAO!
I would strongly advise you to take everything Muwhatever says with a *large* grain of salt.
Even if he stumbles upon the truth, it will be so mangled as to be nearly unrecognizable....:)
[all hail Queen Scota and the Sons of Ir!]
*still giggling over *that*
Dude's been doing that for years on the war between the states threads. Funny it happens elsewhere on FR too.
O...M...G!
I *thought* the user name and “twisted history” gig seemed eerily familiar!
Well, there’s an end to ~that~ total waste of electrons, then.
:D
[Deo Vindice, SB]
Loved your Y’allbonics but a lot of your links I really wanted to read are gone...:(
[And a MSTK3 fan!]
Could you be *more* perfect?....LOL
Crow: “Oh my god...they’re a cult!”
Servo: “And they worship blue oysters!”
Best series, ever.
They DO know who his mother is. On St. Patrick’s Day is father(s) are immaterial, especially since the Irish is on his mother’s side.
Just the way it is.
Current theory (demonstrable at the level of mtDNA) is that Europe was repopulated after the Ice Age by local populations that'd been located in what is roughly the Basque regions South of the Pyrenees.
That's ALL OF EUROPE, not just a little teeny tiny bit.
The older theory had Indo Europeans riding in conquering all before them, becoming dominant, and eliminating whatever bit of the natives they'd met.
One does suppose they ate them eh.
The current theory explains the flow of Indo European languages to the West and North with the movement of agricultural populations from the Middle East!
They moved in. The natives stayed. Some of the natives adopted herding. Some adopted farming. Some moved on up the mountains. Whatever. And they adopted the newcomer's languages simply because they had more and better words that reflected their higher level of technology ~ to wit, growing food!
This leaves us with a simple solution to the problem of how the Irish (Ir is the eldest of three brothers in the ancient myth) came to live in Scota (the land of the Great Goddess). Scotland was initially known as Alba but that was changed in the very recent conquest in the 9th century (simultaneously with the Norse).
It may be a Koinkydink that the ancient Galician records conform to the DNA trail, and that the English stories don't, but I think that's unlikely.
Even Sassanach histories reflect the renaming of Ireland to Scota, and Alba to Scotland ~ your own stuff ~
Now, back to where Galicia was located, it's the entire NW corner of Iberia. Their own gaelic language died out in the 1300/1400 period as best anyone can tell and was replaced with a form of Spanish and/or Portuguese. There was a period of rapid change at the time of the transformation. A couple of other major Gaelic languages were eliminated during the same period in France and were replaced with Gallo (which is like French), and then by French based on the standards of the Isle de France. Breton (a Welsh dialect) is still spoken widely in Brittany. Even both forms of Welsh are spoken in Wales. Cornish died out in relatively modern times but there are still people who are keeping it alive. And so on.
Whatever you think of the alleged Sassanach sources for the various names of the peoples and countrysides of the Celtic Fringe, "Wal" and "Gal" and "Gaul" and "Xal" and wide variety of other variations on that theme have been in use the days the Phoenicians living in their colony of Carthage called their ally in Europe by a name rhyming with the Greek version of the same which was "Magolis", that is, McWallace, and that's pretty doggone ancient ~ but as much as you think the word for that type of folk originated with the Greeks and Romans, the Carthaginians had an even more ancient history of literacy and civilization and they, too, referred to the tribes and leaders according to the very same nomenclature the Galician records use.
Someday you Brits will figure out that the Naaaatives have their own names for themselves ~ then we won't keep running into this "change "the ukraine" to Ukraine" or "Bombay is now Mumbai" business. It's more difficult to change than to get it right the first time.
Oh, yeah, and the 1000BC to 700BC stuff, that's the same time frame the Galicians from the Danube who didn't take the Mediterranean to Spain went to Anatolia and settled in the midst of all the better known ancient peoples.
Everybody knew they were there ~ by Roman times they were known as the Galatians.
But, here's the kicker for you, whatever name the Greeks used for them, that place referred to as "The Gleaming Towers of Illium" ~ others described it as "The Gleaming Towers of Allium" ~ and there's yet another form of "Gal" ~ with the soft A rather than the more guttural sound the primitive Sassanach could only describe as "X" in their Runic alphabet.
What part of Ulster/Scot/Welsh/Danish did you *not* understand?
You must be a moron.
"Ir is the eldest of three brothers in the ancient myth)"
I care nothing for your fairy tales and "myths".
I am interested only in proven scientific archaeology/anthropolgy.
"Even Sassanach histories reflect the renaming of Ireland to Scota, and Alba to Scotland ~ your own stuff ~"
Do NOT -ever- call me a Sassenach [the -correct- spelling; note that] again, you little fairy-tale spewing, Google-hunting lackwit.
And you screwed up the famous 'historical identity' of the Galatians.
[I'm *so* shocked] /s
They were the Gallic people who were living in modern day Turkey...those very same people that St Paul had such a "problem" with.
[does the Biblical chapter of "Galatians" ring a bell?]
"McWallace"
Love to break this to you but -Wallace- is a name of WELSH origin.
There are Wallaces in Scotland *now* but they originated in Wales.
"This leaves us with a simple solution to the problem of how the Irish (Ir is the eldest of three brothers in the ancient myth) came to live in Scota (the land of the Great Goddess)."
No.
This leaves us with the same insane fairy tale delusion you embrace as "history".
Again, there was NO "Queen Scota" and no son "Ir". There is ONLY "Eire"
"EtymologyFurther information: Ériu, Erin, Hibernia, and Iverni
The modern Irish Éire evolved from the Old Irish word Ériu, which was the name of a Gaelic goddess.
Ériu is generally believed to have been the matron goddess of Ireland, a goddess of sovereignty, or simply a goddess of the land.
The origin of Ériu has been traced to the Proto-Celtic reconstruction *Φīwerjon (nominative singular Φīwerjō).
This suggests a descent from the Proto-Indo-European reconstruction *piHwerjon, likely related to the adjectival stem *piHwer- (cf. Sanskrit pīvan, pīvarī and pīvara meaning "fat, full, abounding"). This would suggest a meaning of "abundant land".
This Proto-Celtic form became Īweriū or Īveriū in Proto-Goidelic.
It is highly likely that explorers borrowed and modified this term. During his exploration of northwest Europe (circa 320 BCE), Pytheas of Massilia called the island Ierne (written Ἰέρνη).
In his book Geographia (circa 150 CE), Claudius Ptolemaeus called the island Iouernia (written Ἰουερνία).
Based on these historical accounts, the Roman Empire called the island Hibernia. Thus, the evolution of the word would follow as such:
Proto-Celtic *Φīwerjon (nominative singular Φīwerjō)
Proto-Goidelic *Īweriū or *Īveriū
Old Irish Ériu
Modern Irish Éire
Another etymology is from the Gaelic:
ì (island) + thairr (west) + fónn (land), which together give ì-iar-fhónn, or "westland isle"[3]
This is similar in meaning to the Norse name for Irish people, "west men", which subsequently gave its name to the Icelandic island of Vestmannaeyjar"
In closing;
"Do an leathcheann."
Google that.
Now, I have about 30Gs of software to install and no more time to spare on your "Pop-Up Book of the History of Ireland".
Bugger off, poseur.
By the way, my surname derives from the greatest and most ancient of all [proto]Celtic deities, Lug.
Variations and derivatives of his name can found ALL over Europe, from the Rus steppes, all of the UK, Spain, France, Italy, even unto modern London which was, in the begining called Lugdunum, or “fortress of Lug”.
My fraternal grandmother’s name derives from Surtr, the Norse warrior of Ragnarok.
[and on my mother’s side, her mother’s name derives from “Thor” and her father was of clan MacBeth so Google that]
“Sassenach”, my royal ass.
It’s in your genes ~ and can’t be helped.
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