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To: WOSG
Blacks Law Dictionary (9th Edition) defines ‘Natural Born Citizen’ as “A person born within the jurisdiction of a national government.”


Yes, that is true, BUT what you leave out is that "jurisdiction" is not only "territorial jurisdiction" but it encompasses allegiance owing jurisdiction where the foreign citizen who owes allegiance to a foreign sovereign. A foreign citizen can pass on their foreign sovereign to their child born on a foreign land, therefore, the child is NOT a natural born citizen.

Which comes back around to the 1790 Naturalization Act where Congress made the mistake of "considering" foreign born of American Citizens NBC. They realized very fast that you can't do that, and in the next Naturalization Act of 1795, the erroneous NBC clause disappeared.

As an example that you may even understand... the King of England deemed everyone born in his empire "natural born subjects," but most still could not hold high office or did the commoners, the naturalized people, not to forget the denizens, would not be in line for the crown;

If England can claim foreigners who gave birth to children and claim the children as their natural born subjects, how can a birth overseas in England or any other country be considered a natural born US citizens? You can't. BUT according to what you say that a jus soli birth is the sole criteria to be a natural born citizen, YOU would take that same NBC claim away from people born in foreign countries and only give that natural right to the United States. The kid is either a natural born in one country OR the other country - the child cannot be an NBC of both. A silly logic error that you after-birther don't see or you just lie about it.

623 posted on 11/14/2010 7:05:49 PM PST by Red Steel
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To: WOSG
"The kid is either a natural born in one country OR the other country - the child cannot be an NBC of both. "

And moreover, to clarify this statement above from my post 623, the kid having two different sovereigns who can make a claim on the child as a citizen cannot be a natural born citizen of either.

625 posted on 11/14/2010 7:15:09 PM PST by Red Steel
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To: Red Steel

“Yes, that is true, BUT “

There is no “BUT” ... you are confusing a basic and simple term of art with the legal satisfaction and requirements for that term.

“natural-born citizen” means ‘citizen at time of birth’.

Any arugments over who is a natural-born citizen are arguments over who gets to be a citizen at time of birth.
“A person born within the jurisdiction of a national government” is either a citizen or subject at time of birth.


642 posted on 11/15/2010 8:41:43 AM PST by WOSG (OPERATION RESTORE AMERICAN FREEDOM - NOVEMBER, 2010 - DO YOUR PART!)
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To: Red Steel

“If England can claim foreigners who gave birth to children and claim the children as their natural born subjects, how can a birth overseas in England or any other country be considered a natural born US citizens? You can’t.”

This dilemmas is EASILY resolved.
Natural-born citizens are citizens at birth.
Each country has its own rules for citizenship at birth, and US law is clear that another country’s law HAVE NO EFFECT on our citizenship laws. That is, if some other other country grants citizenship to you for some reason, that has no bearing on whether you have US citizenship rights. In some cases that may lead to dual citizenship.


646 posted on 11/15/2010 9:19:50 AM PST by WOSG (OPERATION RESTORE AMERICAN FREEDOM - NOVEMBER, 2010 - DO YOUR PART!)
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