Posted on 07/06/2010 6:15:26 PM PDT by QualityMan
Don't think you have to get a "small" gun in order to conceal it.
Some people will try to talk you into the latest hand cannon, but it doesn't matter if you don't carry it. I started out with a Springfield XD .45 compact. A very good shooting medium sized auto. For where I lived and the clothing I normally wear in the summer months it was just too big. I had already come to that conclusion before I went to get my CCW so I borrowed several smaller guns that were possible candidates (Nevada requires you shoot the make and model of guns on your license.)
I ended up with the Glock 27 for the following reasons. Small, easy to conceal. Reasonable loadout, although I never could get 9 rounds in the 9 round mag. It was compatible with larger .40 cal Glock mags for a reload. Reliable. Have only had one malfunction with it and that was the mag, so I tossed the magazine. It isn't the funnest to shoot and it isn't the most comfortable to shoot, but that isn't what I was carrying for.
Not at 21 feet. I will take down anything you want in a legal situation.
Hmmmn well .....
“If you have a hand capable of squeezing a very heavy trigger, one of the very best “bad breath range” guns is the .45 ACP AMT Backup.
At close range, the trigger is not a problem (yeah, I shoot at my place so range time is easy come by) and .45ACP or .45 ACP+P is better than the smaller cartridges, IMHO.
At backup range, a .45 is better than anything I could find in that small a size.
Ergonomics of a thumbscrew, [depends on ones hands, I suppose] Great snark, by the way.
12 lb. trigger with a two inch barrel, [3” barrel, actually]
bright sides, [lots of ways to blacken SS]
bites like a badger, [worse than that on the front end, much worse] ;-)
and so heavy it feels like it’s made from depleted uranium!
[Some LEOs had ‘em fitted with tritium sights and something of a trigger job by a shop in WPB. I couldn’t find one of those, alas.]
How did yours feed? Any reliability problems?
Yeah...carried one for two years ;o)
One other thing. If you are in a military component or employed as an EMT, Glock will extend their law enforcement discount to you. A couple hoops to jump through, but I got my G27 for $389 + tax + shipping + and FFL transfer. The FFL was only charged me $15 bucks. The min for that has been $25 since I was a kid.
CZ52, just point it in the air, fire, and everyone runs away.
Correct answer.
That is true. Unfortunately, according to an FBI report I read a month or so ago, even with a fatal shot to the heart, there is sufficient blood in the brain for the attacker to be able to keep coming at you for 20 to 30 seconds. That's a long time. Count it out.
Since I don't have the report in front of me, I'll just go with memory and say that the advice is to shoot so as to immediately disable, i.e., a shot to the brain or neck to instantly disrupt the central nervous system.
But enough of the gruesome stuff, this is a thread on good guns for CC. Sorry.
Actually, no. I don't recall any. But I do seem to remember something funky about an exposed trigger bar....
Of course, by my standards a successful feed WAS a problem!
Went to a Glock 30 after the AMT and haven't looked back since.
The highest velocity round that you can put into a 2” circle consistently at 15 feet.
For some people, that is a .22, for others, that is a 9 mm or a 357. Some can even handle a 41 mag or bigger. But I can not stress double fire accuracy enough.
Shoot the pelvis with something hard hitting, like 357mag. When the pelvic bone breaks, the legs become useless. just like being paralyzed from the waist down.
Also, if the cartridge is powerful enough, the shock wave of the impact temporarily disables all nerves in the area even if they aren’t damaged or directly hit. A 357mag and higher will temporarily paralyze arms and legs even if nerves and bone are untouched. This is what I’ve read anyway.
Unfortunately 357mag from a snubbie won’t do it tho. 357mag loses more power from short barrels than any other handgun cartridge I know of. With extremely short barrels, you are better off with 9mm+P than with 357mag.
Bet you're a thrill to be around at the range ;^)
I agree the 9mm is one of the best in short barrels. Not sure why but I have seen the ballistics tests out of guns such as the Walther P5 which has a 3 inch barrel. The velocity does not fall off much at all.
Probably the worst out of a very short barrel is the .22mag. Around 20 years ago, I had a friend who owned a good quality chronograph. We tested a mini revolver with a 1.5 inch barrel with a .22 LR and magnum cylinder. We chronographed high speed shorts, Long Rifles and Magnums.
The short actually had the highest velocity but since it only had a 29 grain bullet, it didn’t have quite as much energy as the magnum. The surprising thing was all three, the short, LR and Mag. all were within 5 ft. lbs. of each other.
The magnum just might scare someone to death tho. The roar and shock wave was about what one would expect from a high powered pistol in a short barrel.
If I carried one of those tiny pistols, (and there is a place for them) I would keep the .22LR cylinder in and use shorts.
A friend carried his AMT in his pocket for quite some time before I tried it out. The beast cycled, but so slowly it seemed to be a slow motion movie.
Turned out to be full of lint. But, it did fire, load, and return to battery despite lumps of lint that looked as though they had been there long enough to be a new life form evolving in the crevices of the action.
Clearly you are getting a lot of recommendations as this is a passionate topic. Don’t know if anyone has posted this yet so,
get a gun that you are fairly accurate with and that fits your hand. If you have small hands then some of these fine guns mentioned here will not feel comfortable when you grip them. Keep in mind the grip’s texture-do you sweat a lot and live in humid climate - if so, the grip will feel different at the outdoor range with a full magazine of weight than it does in the A/C showroom.
Better to be able to hit your intended target within the first two rounds than to miss with a magazine of 15 high-power bullets.
The typical “situation” involves only 2 or 3 shots exchanged between parties. I like to carry a 15 capacity magazine also, but realize that in any self-defense dilemma, it will be over before firing that many shots. One or both people will flee, be dead/wounded, etc.
If you have a price range, narrow it down that way first. The Glock 26 is indeed a satisfying choice, but so are many of these others mentioned. The Glock is not fancy, sexy, or stylish, but for a CCW who cares about that. Shoot several in your price range. If price is no object, then add LaserMax internal laser sight. It is much better than the Crimson Trace mention earlier IMO, and is a deterent in itself if your situation occurs at night.
Without firing a shot I have seen a couple thugs damn near shit their britches when the red dot is on their center mass. They will turn around and exit quickly unless jacked up on dope.
Happy shopping.
Decide the range of money you want to spend; decide the maximum size and weight that you WILL carry full time; choose the highest caliber that conforms with those criteria. Get suggestions from local gun shops. Feel and shoot (rental) as many of the suggestions as time and money permits. Check out reviews of your final few. Make your selection.
Asking for opinions for specific firearms on here is as valuable as tits on a boar hog. You know what they say about opinions. Do the proper research and form your own.
I have a S&W Sigma 40.. real sweet it comes in 9 or 380 as well
1911...
Most self defense encounters are well under 21 feet. However, happily, MOST bad guys want to break off when they see a gun pulled. Those that charge you are hard core and probably on drugs.
Unfortunately, as OldPossum points out, NO HANDGUN will stop that person in his tracks unless the bullet shreds the brain. Even a 44 Mag with a direct hit to the heart will leave the BG with 10-15 seconds of useful consciousness to attack with a knife, shoot you with HIS gun, etc.
(see the FBI article here, page 8: http://www.firearmstactical.com/pdf/fbi-hwfe.pdf)
Therefor, your choices if charged are 1) shoot and move, 2) wait until very close and chance a brain shot, or 3) shoot, but prepare for hand to hand (or a brain shot at 0 feet).
As for semi-automatic reliability: they are great if you have checked out the ammo first. Many semi-automatics will fire thousands of rounds without a hitch. Some have ammo they don’t like, and you need to make sure you are not using that type.
However, I think the large number of rounds is overrated. As I said, if they don’t run at the first shot or two, and don’t drop immediately when shot (the FBI paper explains that as well), then you have to expect them to shoot back - and one round in the right spot will kill you seconds after they die.
I use a 5-shot Model 60 .357. One round to the chest, then one to the face. Remember George Adamson’s advice on killing a charging lion: Wait until 10 feet, and don’t miss.
Except for home defense, I want to shoot once - no more than twice - then move.
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