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For Windows 8, Microsoft Looks To Apple (Leaked data shows Microsoft immitating Apple)
The Var Guy ^ | 07/06/2010 | Dave Courbanou

Posted on 07/06/2010 12:30:05 PM PDT by SeekAndFind

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To: ThomasThomas

Irish knockoff.


121 posted on 07/07/2010 5:52:05 AM PDT by frithguild (I gave to Joe Wilson the day after, to Scott Brown seven days before and next to JD Hayworth.)
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To: Richard Kimball
Swordmaker has all the details, but Apple did not "steal" the GUI from Xerox.

Very true. OTOH, the question as to whether MSFT stole MS-DOS from Gary Kildall is a bit more open

122 posted on 07/07/2010 7:37:38 AM PDT by Tribune7 (The Democrat Party is not a political organization but a religious cult.)
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To: Soothesayer9
I hear they eventually want to do away with mice/keyboards and go with touch LCD screens and voice.

Lift your hands from the keyboard and put your fingertips on your screen.

Now hold them there for the next eight hours.

Doesn't take too long to come to the conclusion that touch-screen desktop computers are overrated.

Similarly, try speaking aloud everything that you type. Aside from privacy concerns (I really don't want the guy in the next cubicle knowing what I"m ordering from Amazon), voice is basically a command-line interface. And speaking with the clear enunciation and stilted, unnatural style that computer voice recognition requires puts a lot of strain on the old pipes.

And rumor has it they want to have a webcam ID login upon windows boot.

I can't wait to see all the tickets the IT department gets from people who can't log in because they're having a bad hair day.

123 posted on 07/07/2010 7:41:22 AM PDT by ReignOfError
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To: tacticalogic
I've seen accolades about Apples reliability from doing this, and asked if anyone thought the industry would be better off today if Microsoft had adopted that same model early on, instead of writing the OS to be as hardware agnostic as possible and letting the hardware industry develop around it.

So far no one will say they think it would.

The desktop computer came into being without local networks, let alone the Internet. What we're coming to now is a computing world where it doesn't matter much what platform you're using; networks are TCP/IP, files are increasingly in formats based on open standards, and applications can and often do run on servers with a platform-agnostic browser as the user interface.

The question is whether this sort of open exchange would have come about sooner if DOS/Windows had not become a de facto standard -- if we had IBM PCs, Macs, Amigas, and maybe even OS/2 boxes. Probably not.

Cheap commodity hardware running Windows was the Model T of the Internet. It's easy to write flowery, nostalgic odes to the Model T which was, let's face it, it was a pretty crappy car. But it opened the road to millions of people who would go on to get something more reliable, more powerful and infinitely more comfortable.

You could make the argument that if DOS hadn't become the standard, something else would have. That's likely true, but without the might of IBM behind it, it would have taken a lot longer for computers to become inexpensive and attractive enough to get into people's homes. In a world without IBM PC clones, we might be talking about the Mac as an alternative to the Amiga; Commodore had the biggest installed base in homes when DOS and the Mac entered that market.

124 posted on 07/07/2010 7:57:47 AM PDT by ReignOfError
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To: The_Victor
The fact that Xerox has not tried to sue Apple is the clearest indication that the GUI concept wasn't technically stolen. But that doesn't change the fact that idea wasn't Apple's (could not be copyrighted by Apple) and therefore couldn't be stolen from Apple by Microsoft, as alleged in Apple's lawsuit.

Ideas cannot be copyrighted. Specific design elements and implementations can be patented (though "look and feel" patents are controversial), and those elements were introduced on the Mac, duplicated in Windows, and absent on the Alto/Star.

125 posted on 07/07/2010 8:00:16 AM PDT by ReignOfError
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To: PugetSoundSoldier
Still waiting for the iPhone to break out of 3rd place in the Smartphone market...;)

Non-player to a strong third place in three years. Not bad at all, especially considering that Apple only sells phones with AT&T in the US.

And in the bigger scheme of things - the entire cell phone market - Apple is WAY down the list

Apple doesn't care about the entire cell phone market, just like Apple doesn't care about the budget computer market. There's more profit margin in the high-end.

Media infatuation and market share do not necessarily go hand in hand.

Market share and profits do not necessarily go hand in hand. See Dell, big market share, poor profits. Apple is going for the profits, which is what companies are supposed to do. What use is a big market share if it doesn't make you much money?

126 posted on 07/07/2010 8:03:46 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: ReignOfError
Ideas cannot be copyrighted. Specific design elements and implementations can be patented (though "look and feel" patents are controversial), and those elements were introduced on the Mac, duplicated in Windows, and absent on the Alto/Star.

If I understand the legal outcomes correctly, the "ideas cannot be copyrighted" concept was in fact a landmark of Apple vs Microsoft.

127 posted on 07/07/2010 8:04:51 AM PDT by The_Victor (If all I want is a warm feeling, I should just wet my pants.)
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To: ReignOfError; Soothesayer9
I hear they eventually want to do away with mice/keyboards and go with touch LCD screens and voice.

I played with one of the HP iMac competitors at Best Buy. It had a touch screen. Talk about the most useless feature ever on a desktop.

128 posted on 07/07/2010 8:13:09 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: ReignOfError
All true, to varying degrees. One of the first things IBM did with the PC was emulate a 3270 terminal. The Intel 8086/8088 chips were offspring of the 8080, which was designed for a programmable terminal. Whether this amounts to a "local network" or whether SNA is really a "networking protocol" may be debatable, but the groundwork was already there. IBM missed the boat by hanging onto token ring for so long and refusing to adopt etherenet, and that hurt them.

At any rate, for all the moaning about how much better the Apple closed hardware model is for the individual end user, no one will argue it would have been better for the industry if Microsoft had adopted it.

Even the open source hobbyist software development benefitted from the explosion of hardware inventors, innovators and manufacturers that suddenly had a wide open market for their ideas and products. You could pick up a used commodity PC at a yard sale that originally shipped with Windows, wipe it, install your preferred flavor of Linux and be off an running.

129 posted on 07/07/2010 8:30:56 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: antiRepublicrat
Non-player to a strong third place in three years.

Android has gone from non-player to a strong 4th place in just 2 years...;)

The iPhone is a good device, but it's only moderately successful when you look at the Smartphone market. Too many confuse the current media hype over the iPhone as market dominance (I believe that was a word used earlier) when the reality is that it still has a way to go to have any shot at all at the top dog (Nokia, with ~3 times the market share).

Just to put this in perspective: Apple has sold about 50 million iPhones since the introduction, back in January 2007. That's a lot of iPhones!

However, 50 million phones would be a good MONTH for Nokia.

So it's 3.5 years of sales, or ~5 weeks of sales. There's a HUGE difference there.

Market share and profits do not necessarily go hand in hand. See Dell, big market share, poor profits.

See Microsoft - big market share, huge profits. Hewlett Packard - monster market share ($114 billion in sales - more than Apple and Microsoft combined) and also big profits (more than Apple, less than Microsoft).

Big market share may not guarantee big profits, but it makes it a LOT easier to do so!

130 posted on 07/07/2010 8:35:00 AM PDT by PugetSoundSoldier (Indignation over the Sting of Truth is the defense of the indefensible)
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To: BunnySlippers
Why is it that every Microsoft FanBoy feels the need to convert.

Ever notice how atheists attack Christian, same fervor. Strange but true.

131 posted on 07/07/2010 9:09:57 AM PDT by itsahoot
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To: BunnySlippers
Why is it that every Microsoft FanBoy feels the need to convert.

Ever notice how atheists attack Christian, same fervor. Strange but true.

132 posted on 07/07/2010 9:10:05 AM PDT by itsahoot
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To: PugetSoundSoldier
Android has gone from non-player to a strong 4th place in just 2 years...;)

Your own chart shows Android in 6th place. Interesting how you describe Android's 7M behind Apple's 25M as "strong" while you describe Apple's 25M behind RIM's 34M as "distant."

The iPhone is a good device, but it's only moderately successful when you look at the Smartphone market.

Non-player to over a quarter of the market in three years cannot be honestly called only moderately successful. Android had the advantage of leveraging existing hardware OEMs (with brand names well-known in phones), sales channels, contracts, and business relationships. Apple started from scratch.

However, 50 million phones would be a good MONTH for Nokia.

You keep flipping back and forth between the smart phone and general phone markets.

133 posted on 07/07/2010 9:26:20 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: tacticalogic
Microsoft doesn’t build computers.

Well, no, but we have an idea of Microsoft thinking in the design department with the ugly XBox series.

134 posted on 07/07/2010 10:05:57 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: PugetSoundSoldier
No way Apple will jump in and be profitable from day one; that just doesn’t happen. It costs money - LOTS of money - to design and build hardware, especially something as focused as a gaming console.
Apple doesn’t have anywhere near 45% of any market, save the music player market in the US
. . . they just target the top end, most profitable niche in a market, and dominate that. Making commodities just isn't Steve Jobs' bag.
Apple will make a gaming console when, as, and if they can pitch it as "insanely great" and back it up. They don't want to compete in a category, they want to transcend the categories in our collective minds.

They want to surprise us. "Oh, and one more thing . . ."

So no, I don't expect Apple to enter the gaming console market as currently defined.
IMHO

135 posted on 07/07/2010 10:19:00 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion ( DRAFT PALIN)
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To: antiRepublicrat
Well, no, but we have an idea of Microsoft thinking in the design department with the ugly XBox series.

Granted. Apple will probably be high on the list for people who walk into a computer store, and when asked what their system requirements are will say "Well, it has to be pretty."

136 posted on 07/07/2010 10:23:33 AM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic
Apple will probably be high on the list for people who walk into a computer store, and when asked what their system requirements are will say "Well, it has to be pretty."

Are you really under the impression that people walk into a computer store, rattle off a list of system requirements, then buy a computer sight unseen?

137 posted on 07/07/2010 11:59:18 AM PDT by ReignOfError
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To: ReignOfError
Are you really under the impression that people walk into a computer store, rattle off a list of system requirements, then buy a computer sight unseen?

I'm under the impression that when people walk into a computer store looking for a system, cosmetics isn't usually high on the requirements list. I will consider any evidence to the contrary, and could change my mind depending on what that evidence is.

138 posted on 07/07/2010 12:15:05 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: dayglored
Those of us old enough to remember when the first Macs came out without a keyboard because the mouse was all you needed, and the first terminal emulators had to have a pull-down menu for a keyboard in case the user was on a mouse-only machine, think "The Wheel" is uproariously funny.

I believe your memory is a tad faulty, dayglored. The original Macintosh as released on January 22, 1984, came with a keyboard and a mouse. What it lacked and people complained about were cursor keys for keyboard navigation. Apple's response was that the mouse was sufficient for moving around text windows.


139 posted on 07/07/2010 1:32:05 PM PDT by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE is AAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: Swordmaker
Yep, there's the keyboard


140 posted on 07/07/2010 1:53:59 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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