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To: anniegetyourgun

The point is not whether he’s a citizen (although even that’s in doubt) but whether he’s what is required to be President - a natural born citizen. And, quite clearly, on this definition he’s not. It requires someone to be born in the U.S.A. of U.S. citizen parents. Quite patently Obama fails this test. The birth certificate is irrelevant in this regard.

I live in Australia and used to think that this requirement, falling as it does on someone’s background something they have no control over, was unfair and unreasonable. I’ve now changed my mind.

In any case, its not what anyone thinks of it, its what it is unless and until its changed and HE FAILS THE TEST.


16 posted on 05/14/2010 3:53:21 PM PDT by Nipfan (The desire to save humanity is always a false front for the urge to rule it - H L Mencken)
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To: Nipfan
The point is not whether he’s a citizen (although even that’s in doubt) but whether he’s what is required to be President - a natural born citizen. And, quite clearly, on this definition he’s not.

Yet that definition is not code, nor has it ever existed as the US legal definition of natural born citizen.

It requires someone to be born in the U.S.A. of U.S. citizen parents.

This definition, sure. By English Common Law (which is also a foundation and source for the legal system of the US - it's not just Vattel as is often claimed here), jus soli is sufficient.

The issue is not what is a potential definition of a natural born citizen; the issue is what is the legal definition within the US. Note that in United States v. Wong Kim Ark the majority position of the Supreme Court held that English Common Law held sway, and thus jus soli is the law of the land.

It's also interesting to note that the dissent in the Ark case proffered Vattel's position as the proper position; however, since that was the minority it has no legal bearing or force and is secondary to the majority position, jus soli - natural born citizen by virtue of birth on US soil.

I'm sure I'll have dozens jump in here and tell me I'm wrong and don't understand, that I'm an idiot or Obamabot. Happened many times in the past. Of course, not a single one can tell me why the minority position of Ark is definitely the proper position, when it was rejected by the majority of the Supreme Court in the decision of just what is a natural born citizen. Lots of dancing and links, but no one is able to get around this very simple fact: in the case dealing with the birth on US soil of a child of foreign parents, the Supreme Court ruled - and has upheld in subsequent cases - that jus soli is the law of the land when it comes to Natural Born Citizenship.

27 posted on 05/14/2010 4:29:31 PM PDT by PugetSoundSoldier (Indignation over the Sting of Truth is the defense of the indefensible)
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