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To: old republic
than the children of subjects of any foreign government born within the domain of that government, or the children born within the United States of ambassadors or other public ministers of foreign nations.

Look at those words:

children of subjects of any foreign government born within the domain of that government

Highlighted part in particular. Born in a public hospital isn't within the domain of a foreign government.

the children born within the United States of ambassadors or other public ministers of foreign nations

If your parent is not an ambassador or other official representative of a foreign Government, then this clause does not apply.

So, under the 14th Amendment, how would a person born in a public hospital NOT be covered? How would they qualify for either of these only two exclusions to citizenship?

38 posted on 05/08/2010 2:15:05 PM PDT by PugetSoundSoldier (Indignation over the Sting of Truth is the defense of the indefensible)
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To: LucyT; BP2; rxsid; Candor7; null and void

ping


39 posted on 05/08/2010 2:25:32 PM PDT by tutstar (Baptist Ping List-freepmail me to be included or removed. <{{{><)
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To: PugetSoundSoldier
Born in a public hospital isn't within the domain of a foreign government.

I see your point, but earlier up in the opinion the court says that anyone born in the territorial US owing immediate allegiance to an Indian tribe (an alien though dependent power) does NOT become an American citizen even if born in the US. If an Indian tribe is a dependent foreign power and can't be born a US citizen simply by being born in the geographic US, how can anyone argue that the child of an independent and alien power (i.e. foreign nation) can claim US citizenship by simply being born in the US? IMHO, such a conclusion cannot logically follow from this court opinion. The court case clearly states that geographic location of birth does guarantee citizenship to anyone if they are the child of foreign citizens. For easier reference here is the quote from that court case cited again below.

Indians born within the territorial limits of the United States, members of and owing immediate allegiance to one of the Indiana tribes (an alien though dependent power), although in a geographical sense born in the United States, are no more "born in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof," within the meaning of the first section of the Fourteenth Amendment, than the children of subjects of any foreign governmentborn within the domain of that government, or the children born within the United States of ambassadors or other public ministers of foreign nations.

By the way, on a slight tangent the two authors of the 14th amendment had the following to say about the meaning of the citizenship clause:Sen Jacob Howards author of the Citizenship clause said this when introducing the amendment in the Senate:

[T]his amendment which I have offered is simply declaratory of what I regard as the law of the land already, that every person born within the limits of the United States, and subject to their jurisdiction, is by virtue of natural law and national law a citizen of the United States. This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of persons.

The other co-author of the 14th amendment in the House said:

"I find no fault with the introductory clause, which is simply declaratory of what is written in the Constitution, that every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen."

53 posted on 05/08/2010 4:21:48 PM PDT by old republic
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