You were saying ...
So, we should submit to evil doers and the Founders sinned. I see.
You'll note that you said, up above, prior to that ...
Paul presumes the “rulers” are forces of good there. Not doers of evil themselves.
And that's where you're wrong... as you can see what Paul says here... For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God.
Again, "there is no authority except from God" -- and -- "the authorities that exist are appointed by God."
That complete and all inclusive. That's what God says... If you don't like what God says, you can take it up with Him as I don't have anything to do with how that came out... LOL...
Interestingly enough, the Sheep and the Goat parable you quote is often used to disprove dispensationalism and the 1830’s era millennial movement to which you belong.
More like someone doesn't like what they hear about Jesus coming back, separating out the nations into the Sheep and Goat judgment, casting those of the "goat judgement" into outer darkness and those of the sheep, going into the kingdom.
Sorry, that's what God says, but it's not new that many don't like what God says, but that's not my business if they don't like it. I only care that He said what He did, and that's good enough for me... :-)
And that's exactly the same understanding as you'll get from Charles Ryrie and John Walvoord, both of Dallas Theological Seminary (for just two to start with) along with a whole host of others... some of which I have the names... :-)
Here's a sampling of some prominent names in Christian circles, but, by no means all of them (just a sample for you, right now...).
- Dr. John Ankerberg
- Mrs. Kay Arthur
- Dr. Mark Bailey
- Dr. Paul Benware
- Dr. Ron Bigalke, Jr.
- Dr. Charles Blair
- Dr. Dave Breese
- Mr. Ray Brubaker
- Dr. Howard Bixby
- Dr. Joseph Chambers
- Rev. J. R. Church
- Dr. Mal Couch
- Dr. Larry Crutchfield
- Dr. Robert Dean, Jr.
- Mr. Martin DeHaan
- Dr. Jimmy DeYoung
- Dr. Timothy Demy
- Dr. Lambert Dolphin
- Dr. Charles Dyer
- Dr. Thomas Edgar
- Dr. Paul Enns
- Dr. John Feinberg
- Dr. Thomas Figart
- Dr. Harold Foos
- Mr. Gordon Franz
- Dr. Gary Fraizer
- Mr. Arno Froese
- Dr. Arnold Fruchtenbaum
- Dr. Norman Geisler
- Mr. Mike Gendron
- Mr. Steven Ger
- Dr. Kenneth Gillming
- Mr. Phillip Goodman
- Dr. Gary Gromacki
- Dr. Robert Gromacki
- Dr. Kenneth Hanna
- Dr. John F. Hart
- Dr. Mark Hitchcock
- Mr. Zane Hodges
- Dr. H. Wayne House
- Mr. Dave Hunt
- Mr. W. Terry James
- Dr. David Jeremiah
- Dr. Elliott Johnson
- Dr. Manfred Kober
- Dr. Woodrow Kroll
- Dr. David Lanier
- Dr. Harry Leafe
- Dr. David Allen Lewis
- Dr. Steven Lewis
- Dr. Robert Lightner
- Dr. Hal Lindsey
- Dr. Jobe Martin
- Dr. John Master
- Dr. Richard Mayhue
- Dr. Thomas McCall
- Dr. Steven McAvoy
- Mr. Elwood McQuaid
- Mr. Paul Van Noy
- Dr. William Grant Nelson
- Dr. Chuck Missler
- Rev. John Nieder
- Dr. John Niemela
- Dr. David Noebel
- Dr. Charles L. Pack
- Dr. Paige Patterson
- Dr. J. Dwight Pentecost
- Mr. Bill Perkins
- Rev. Donald Perkins
- Mr. Mark Piland
- Dr. Earl Radmacher
- Dr. Ron Rhodes
- Dr. Charles Ryrie
- Dr. Renald Showers
- Dr. Lonnie Shipman
- Dr. Larry Spargimano
- Dr. Mike Stallard
- Dr. Gerald Stanton
- Dr. Steve Sullivan
- Dr. Hilton Sutton
- Dr. John Sweigart
- Dr. Paul Lee Tan
- Dr. Robert Thomas
- Dr. Stanley Toussaint
- Dr. Elmer Towns
- Mr. Joe Van Koevering
- Dr. Jerry Vines
- Dr. Robert Wilkin
- Dr. Harold Wilmington
- Dr. John Witmer
- Dr. Roy Zuck
And that's only to say, that studied and scholarly men of God, with degrees from various seminaries, have seen that the Bible says the same thing as I've just related to you about the Kingdom of God.
Now..., there's absolutely no reason you have to accept it for yourself, but that doesn't mean, because you don't accept it, that this is not what the Bible says. Too many scholars and theologians have already spoken on the issue... LOL...
And besides that, I don't even need one of those scholar men and pastors and preachers to tell me that this is what the Bible says, because I also read it in the Word of God... so that's clear for anyone who "has an ear to hear"... as Jesus says.
Jesus says several times and in many places that "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches." [Rev 2:7]; "If anyone has an ear, let him hear." [Rev 13:9] ... of course, the opposite is that those who don't have an ear, won't hear... :-)
Not everyone wants to "hear"...
"Again, "there is no authority except from God" -- and -- "the authorities that exist are appointed by God." "
So (I'll ask again) do you believe this to mean that the Founders were wrong and there is a divine right of kings? Remember that Paul's Epistles were LETTERS to specific churches....
"More like someone doesn't like what they hear about Jesus coming back, separating out the nations into the Sheep and Goat judgment, casting those of the "goat judgement" into outer darkness and those of the sheep, going into the kingdom."
More like someone understands that "nations", in this case, refers to "the peoples of the Earth" as in ethnos, not modern nation states. The outer darkness is Hell and the Kingdom referenced is Heaven. You speak of Judgement Day, not the inauguration of a theological government.
"And that's exactly the same understanding as you'll get from Charles Ryrie and John Walvoord, both of Dallas Theological Seminary (for just two to start with) along with a whole host of others... some of which I have the names... :-)"
There you go again... with your appeals to authority. "Learned men" disagree about a whole host of things in the Bible. Calvinists believe one line means we have no free will but are predestined. Catholics base their entire claims to Apostolic Succession to another line. Some "learned men of God" want us to call God Allah to make the Muslims feel better. Some "learned men of God" endorse the ordainment of homosexual clergy. Some "learned men of God" were Pharisees. A degree just means you passed the classes - even seminary degrees.
The dispensationalist movement began in the 1830s.
"Now..., there's absolutely no reason you have to accept it for yourself, but that doesn't mean, because you don't accept it, that this is not what the Bible says. Too many scholars and theologians have already spoken on the issue... LOL..."
I see we are back to derisive laughter. You believe what you have been *told*. I believe what I can read and pray about myself - something we Southern Baptists are good at. "Theologians" speak on a host of issues. They also don't all AGREE on those issues.
"Not everyone wants to "hear"..."
Indeed. You certainly don't. If you should strive to try to convince someone your personal view of the Bible was the correct one, I'd suggest dropping the derisive and insulting attitude.