Replies

“Practice as a doctor, Nurse, certified engineer, lawyer or veterinarian”

Guess what? You’re wrong. I’m an engineer. We STILL don’t have to be licensed"

Guess what? I'm talking about Civil engineers. Nice canard though.

All states require that any civil Professional Engineer (PE) involved in building infrastructure etc. be licensed by the state. This authorizes the PE to certify plans with an official stamp and puts their name and accountability on the line if something goes wrong. If there is a state that doesn't, then I would certainly avoid traveling there.

You are not going to hold yourself out as a civil engineer to design and approve plans for critical buildings and structures in the US or most civilized countries without government professional "licensing" and certification or other government credentialing oversight showing you have passed a set level of professional testing to prove you know at least something about what you are doing (and some of these tests and credentialing are pretty tough). Further, should one engage in malpractice then your credentials can be revoked. If one then attempts to continue without the required credentials, then an injunction by a court will be issued. If one defies that, one defies the court and it progresses downhill from there.

Same thing with a drivers license. It is a credential that states you have passed the minimum level of testing required and demonstrates that you know at least the basics about how to safely operate a motor vehicle on public roads and that you physically qualified to do so. It is not a "right". This is the will of the people that it be so. You, apparently, are the odd duck out. That's your right but you won't find many agreeing with your idea about how driving is a "Natural Law Right - License Not Required", especially those who have had family members maimed or killed by drunk or negligent drivers.

Just because someone passes the test and is issued a driver's license does not mean one will follow the rules or is even a safe or skilled driver. That is where the enforcement part of the system comes in and license revocation when required.

Kind of getting the idea about the way modern societies operate here? Just trying to help you out with this driver's license thing you got going here.

Don't confuse "Big Brother Government Abuse" and "The Mark of The Beast" and all that jazz with the simple realities of society needing people to be licensed to drive when operating the current technology that we posses and use. Its not an automatic right. Those are separate issues. Even if Libertarians or Conservatives had total control of society - you would still be doing the drivers license thing. Your contention that driving is a "natural law right" and that people shouldn't have to have a driver's license is ludicrous under the current system and can be dismissed.

You claim to be an engineer; frankly I'm somewhat amazed that you have difficulty with these concepts. You are certainly one of a kind as I have never met a civil engineer who isn't all about loving rules, regulations, procedures, orderly society and such and is a very logical and mind-ordered person. You didn't state what type of engineer you are. That word is very loosely thrown around these days BTW. But since you list a bunch of mechanical engineers and inventors, I am assuming your interest lies in mechanical engineering.

Here's the rub: Anytime you ask or require someone to put their name and accountability on the line, there is always a segment of the population that this rubs the wrong way and they will immediately say things like "well, that stifles my creativity", etc. We are not talking about pure art here - we are talking about sensible public safety. If you were to get to the actual root of the issue, the real problem with these individuals is they want to be able to do whatever they want but not be held accountable for anything. And that is simply an indication of a lack of maturity. Banks, hedge funds crooked brokers and Ponzi Schemes want to be able to do whatever they want with no accountability. Clinton wants to be able to lie under oath - and not be held one bit accountable. So why shouldn't everyone else if the president says it's ok? Most young children are the same way. They want to be able to do whatever they want without any accountability. In real life, that usually that results in innocent people being injured or killed by careless or negligent people. Responsibility and accountability must be taught. Some adults never learn it. The prison system is jam packed full of them.

I suppose you are all for having your kids or grand kids be taken across bridges built by unlicensed contractors and engineers who didn't know what they were doing. Or sitting in schools that have fatal design flaws because just anyone was allowed to design and build them.

We tried that in the past before we knew what we were doing as a modern nation. The US was once a backwater 3rd world nation, believe it or not. Much of our technological prowess early on came from Europe where civilizations date back thousands of years. Heck - WE came from Europe for the most part. In times past, the results of engineering were not always consistent and people lost their lives due to carelessness, ineptness, ignorance and incompetence. So things were improved upon and regulated and now the rate of man-made catastrophe has been reduced as far a civil engineering goes. You know, all those little things people take for granted like Fire Codes, Building Codes, Electrical Codes. Or in the case of some people "all those codes and rules an' stuff, its all a Big Commie Plot! Uh, no. Not everything is a Commie plot. Most things - yes.

How do you think America overcame any earlier design flaws and shortcomings to evolve as the great nation that it once evolved to? Now we are devolving into the failed policies of Marxism.

I see you threw a few a few noted inventors and mechanical engineers from the early industrial revolution in the mix that harken back to a time when there were also great calamities by fire and failed engineering that killed a lot of people by dam failures, and such. How about asbestos? Great idea and great product - until we found out a wee bit more about it. I imagine you would like to go back to those times of little to no regulation with regards to civil engineering, building, fire and electrical codes. Nice straw man, but has little to do with your contention that people shouldn't have to be licensed to drive cars and that driving is a "natural law right".

I think what you don't want, is anyone to have any enforceable personal accountability. When someone robs a bank or kills someone by criminal negligence, they are tried, convicted and punished. This is called Justice - which is another word for - "forced personal accountability" Mankind has operated this way for eons.

Most people will tell you that there are limits to freedom. Even in America. I understand that some people have a problem with that. If there is a TOTALLY 100% absolutely free society somewhere where you can do whatever you want with no regulation or accountability whatsoever, that is not some 3rd world dung heap - name it.