But what you’re describing here has such a broad definition that it means the U.S, has been, in one way or another, socialist since the inception of an income tax.
Do I need to back up my assumption of what you guys are talking about and realize that Freerepublic favors a full abolishing of the income tax? Or taxes of any kind?
Because pretty much since the 20th century, the government has been taking money from one group of people and giving it to another group of people in one way or another.
If you pay taxes in Maine, and the government builds a highway that runs across the Southern part of the country - that’s socialist?
Is using taxpayer money to fund the space program - which primarily benefits those living in and around Cape Canaveral and other space centers socialism?
An argument could be made that money spent on every weapons system ever, was socialist - because it benefits one sector of the population and not others. You can make a broader argument that the weapon system will contribute to the national security - but you can, and many economists have, make the argument that middle class tax cut benefits the economy as a whole because the driving engine of the economy is the sale and purchase of consumer goods and without a tax cut - the consumer index goes down which - matched with the credit crunch and mortgage meltdown - leads to a seizing up of our economy’s gears and then...I dunno. Maybe Thunderdome.
I think we’re all just trying to avoid Thunderdome.
And the government is not coming in to take over industry in a hostile manner. They’re not even taking over, they’re buying up bad debt and keeping them solvent. These industries were asking for help. The way the airline industry was when it basically collapsed after 9/11. I don’t think anyone is looking for a scenario in which the government owns everything - these were drastic measures that a Republican president took to - hopefully - prevent a massive, and likely global, financial meltdown.
So if that’s supporting socialism - then fine. Give me the big S. I think what is happening now was necessary - and there are guys with Nobel prizes, decades of experience and very high placed jobs in corporations who agree with that. There’s lots of disagreement over the specifics and the balance being struck between “The Big S” and maintaining the integrity of our private markets - but there was a near consensus all over the financial world that without intervention - we were facing an economic calamity of unspeakable proportions.
There are some who say that is still coming, and we maybe only softened the blow a bit. I hope they’re wrong.
But I don’t think just because something fits the definition of socialism, it is evil. I mean...isn’t the post office, technically, a “socialist” program? I think the Union has done okay since its inception.
Do I think that American democracy is so fragile that adopting any kind of socialist policy will somehow lead us down the path to communism or autocracy? No, I don’t.
The Left believed that The Patriot Act was going to do this, and that the Bush administration was power grabbing or overstepping - and in some cases, they were. The courts stepped in, we had an election, things have come to light - it was never as bad as some feared - and the country came through okay.
No, I was very specific. I stated that taking money from one group of people and giving it to another group of people is socialist. This is a far cry from all contributing a portion of their earnings to build and maintain things that benefit all. But that said America has been on a slow slide to socialism for some time. It's now accelerating.
Senator Obama speaks constantly about sacrifice. Of course Senator Obama and Senator Biden have sacrificed nothing, a casual look at their military service or charitable donations over the years before Senator Obama hit it big with his book is a fine testament to that fact. But if Senator Obama has his way a majority of the electorate will pay NO federal income tax. So my question to you is, where is the sacrifice Travis? What have you sacrificed?
I'm not opposed to taxes. We need to all contribute to infrastructure, the military etc. I am opposed to unlimited government and I'll tell you why.
I witnessed close and in person Lyndon Johnson's Great Society which ravaged the urban family, left young men without fathers and filled up prisons. That was all predictable. When the state becomes the Daddy there is no reason for the Daddy to be at home with the youngsters. When the state offers incentives to move the Daddy out of the house, guess what, the Daddy leaves. Liberalism, the democrat kind that is, is a failure. One need only look at what Johnson wrought to understand that.
So now we have another liberal POTUS with large majorities in each chamber. History tells me this is not going to turn out well. Individual responsibility, freedom and strong families are not fed by Daddy Government and that's exactly where we are once again heading.
And by the way, since you favor Senator Obama's plan to mandate community service do you also favor being drafted for the common good? I am quite interested in your response to that question I posed above.