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To: FTL
I think you're giving Bill Ayers WAY too much credit here. This meeting that was infiltrated in which members of the Underground were planning murders, I do not believe Ayers was present for.

Ayers WAS a deluded, idiot radical who was so distraught over the deaths of soldiers in Vietnam he started bombing buildings. Dumb, yes. "most violent, sociopathic left wing Raidal extremist" - I think you're inflating Ayers impact on the world by an order of magnitude.

Ayers is, now, a community activist and educator. He doesn't live in a cave or a fortress of doom. The guy doesn't even have a criminal record, unlike other members of the Underground. Ayers is just another 60s radical who flirted with socialism and communism and now participates in his community. In the suburbs.

If you think there's more nefariousness there, then by all means keep digging - but I don't think there's any there, there. And the press has been looking.

And a coffee at Ayers house was one of several that Obama had at the beginning of his campaign for State office. Unless you find more connections, I don't believe this is ever going to be an issue - as was proven when it had almost no affect when Palin and McCain hammered away at it in the final weeks of the campaign.

But - let's say Ayers was more diabolical and nefarious. Still planning some kind of insurgent action against the U.S. Having a coffee at his house and serving on some sort of planning committee with him would place Obama on the level of Mao and Hitler?

You don't have to stop dogging us over this, but I just don't think it's working.

611 posted on 11/09/2008 10:27:10 PM PST by Traviswf
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To: Traviswf

But of course, this is your purpose here. Downplay, attempt to diffuse.

I just don’t think its working.

If Obama rules from the center, he’ll probably survive this, politically speaking. Its up to him to prove to us we can trust him after all his lifelong associations with the radical Left. If there was a Republican in the White House who had even a tenth of the radical associations that Obama had - you guys would be doing the same thing - preparing - just in case.

If he attempts to go far Left and crush us - no American will want to see the results of such a blunder and it would be the end of America as we know it. You guys already think we’re nuts. I can assure you we’re perfectly sane, we just won’t be trampled over. We have seen it happen too many times under Marxism and we’ll not go to the box cars quietly.

Two things will radicalize your opposition and set them aflame in a way that will never restore order.

1). Any attempt at infringing on our gun ownership rights, and that includes further attempts at restriction or attempting to make them economically unattainable.

2). Any attempt to silence us by imposing a Censorship Doctrine.

Seems to me, that he can give those two items up when in reality whatever he tried to impose along those lines wouldn’t work anyway. So why even go there? Why inflame and radicalize further? Give further proof and justification? It just pushes things into more political instability.

There is really no further line he can cross with abortion, so nothing will change there on that front that would inflame this side any further than it already stays at any given time.

Attempting to put gays in the military - he will probably do that and it will cause a mass exodus out of the military. And thus ends our professional military. Still, that probably would just enrage the military. I was in when Clinton tried that - and it enraged and caused radicalization. Big blunder and he backed down. The policy in place is the best possible policy. No, you guys won’t get open gays in the military. You just need to pick middle of the road economic policies.

Don’t tread on our guns or free speech and maybe things will stabilize. I’m not holding my breath and the radicals on the Left will push him to overreach and then it will be on. In the end, they’ll regret it.

All this of course, is presuming that we don’t get to the bottom of this birthplace origin question. You know if its there - we will find it.


616 posted on 11/09/2008 11:11:08 PM PST by FTL
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To: Traviswf
...But - let's say Ayers was more diabolical and nefarious. Still planning some kind of insurgent action against the U.S....

William Ayers dedicated his new book Praire Fire to, among many others, one Sirhan Sirhan.

Your party, namely Barack Obama, gave him grants to "educate" children in Chicago.

As recently as 9/11/01 he was stepping on the flag while his countrymen were being buried.

How do you defend somebody like this by attempting to minimise what he did?

639 posted on 11/10/2008 4:23:23 PM PST by jwalsh07 (It's the Marxism Stupid!)
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