Senate Ignores U.S. Constitution

Pfesser | 10/01/08 | Pfesser

[Pfesser]

Fox news reports:Senate to Vote on Rescue Plan With Added Tax Cut

Article 1 Section 7

All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives;
but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.

Not only are they moving towards Socialism but now they have trashed the Constitution.

[Petronski]

It’s being amended to a bill the House DID send to the Senate.

[Pfesser]

The source is ARTICLE 1, SECTION 7 OF THE U.S. CONSTITUTION!
Ever heard of it,huh?

[IGOTMINE]

This thought occured to me on the way into work today.

The US Constitution: Hey, it’s optional!

[deport]

The bill failed in the House. Therefore, it is dead.

---

Defeated bills can be resurrected. Didn’t you see the Rep. asked the chair immediately after the vote if he asked to have the bill reconsidered when would it be brought back up. The chair told him immediately and he dropped his persuit at that time. My guess is he wanted to have it brought back up at a date later and thus have time to persuade 10 of the democrat/republican no votes to yes votes and thus pass the bill assuming all the other votes stayed the same.

Raising revenue and spending money are two different things.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives;

I am under the impression that they are dispensing revenue, not raising it. No problemo.

[hiredhand]

Here's the entire text of Article 1, Section 7 -

U.S. Constitution - Article 1 Section 7 Article 1 - The Legislative Branch Section 7 - Revenue Bills, Legislative Process, Presidential Veto

All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.

Every Bill which shall have passed the House of Representatives and the Senate, shall, before it become a Law, be presented to the President of the United States; If he approve he shall sign it, but if not he shall return it, with his Objections to that House in which it shall have originated, who shall enter the Objections at large on their Journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If after such Reconsideration two thirds of that House shall agree to pass the Bill, it shall be sent, together with the Objections, to the other House, by which it shall likewise be reconsidered, and if approved by two thirds of that House, it shall become a Law. But in all such Cases the Votes of both Houses shall be determined by Yeas and Nays, and the Names of the Persons voting for and against the Bill shall be entered on the Journal of each House respectively. If any Bill shall not be returned by the President within ten Days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the Same shall be a Law, in like Manner as if he had signed it, unless the Congress by their Adjournment prevent its Return, in which Case it shall not be a Law.

Every Order, Resolution, or Vote to which the Concurrence of the Senate and House of Representatives may be necessary (except on a question of Adjournment) shall be presented to the President of the United States; and before the Same shall take Effect, shall be approved by him, or being disapproved by him, shall be repassed by two thirds of the Senate and House of Representatives, according to the Rules and Limitations prescribed in the Case of a Bill.

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If they follow through with this, they will have committed sedition against the Republic. People who call NEED to point out that not only are those legislators in support of this bail out BRAIN DEAD but that they're in direct violation of the U.S. Constitution.

[hiredhand]

Here's the entire text of Article 1, Section 7 -

U.S. Constitution - Article 1 Section 7 Article 1 - The Legislative Branch Section 7 - Revenue Bills, Legislative Process, Presidential Veto

All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.

Every Bill which shall have passed the House of Representatives and the Senate, shall, before it become a Law, be presented to the President of the United States; If he approve he shall sign it, but if not he shall return it, with his Objections to that House in which it shall have originated, who shall enter the Objections at large on their Journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If after such Reconsideration two thirds of that House shall agree to pass the Bill, it shall be sent, together with the Objections, to the other House, by which it shall likewise be reconsidered, and if approved by two thirds of that House, it shall become a Law. But in all such Cases the Votes of both Houses shall be determined by Yeas and Nays, and the Names of the Persons voting for and against the Bill shall be entered on the Journal of each House respectively. If any Bill shall not be returned by the President within ten Days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the Same shall be a Law, in like Manner as if he had signed it, unless the Congress by their Adjournment prevent its Return, in which Case it shall not be a Law.

Every Order, Resolution, or Vote to which the Concurrence of the Senate and House of Representatives may be necessary (except on a question of Adjournment) shall be presented to the President of the United States; and before the Same shall take Effect, shall be approved by him, or being disapproved by him, shall be repassed by two thirds of the Senate and House of Representatives, according to the Rules and Limitations prescribed in the Case of a Bill.

---

If they follow through with this, they will have committed sedition against the Republic. People who call NEED to point out that not only are those legislators in support of this bail out BRAIN DEAD but that they're in direct violation of the U.S. Constitution.

The link to my notes on the CRA of 1977 are HERE.

[CA Conservative]

You are operating from a flawed assumption. The Senate is not originating a revenue bill - they are amending an existing bill already passed by the House. To quote the section of the Constitution you listed:

"All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills."

As I stated above, the vote on Monday was technically to agree to an amendment proposed by the Senate. The original bill has not had a final vote yet. That bill can still be amended, and the original bill originated in the House, and was a revenue bill.

Just to see how screwed up the process is, do you want to know what the title of the original bill is?

"HR 3997: To amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to provide earnings assistance and tax relief to members of the uniformed services, volunteer firefighters, and Peace Corps volunteers, and for other purposes"

[bamahead]

The title says it all...



Libertarian ping! Click here to get added or here to be removed or just reply to this post!

[hiredhand]

Here's the bottom line....and I've pretty much heard this from others over the past several days who represent the vast sea of "unknowns" in America.

We (unknowns) pay for everything we have. We've always done this. We didn't rush out and buy two and three houses to sell at an obscene profit on the run up to the bubble burst of the subprime market. In fact, we sat back and watched it, not completely understanding at the time why it was happening, but understanding all the same that we probably didn't want anything to do with it.

We (unknowns) can survive for a long time on little or nothing. This is primarily because we don't OWE anybody, anything. Also, an uncountable number of us have put up enough food and supplies to supply small armies for months, and months.

Here's what's going to happen if our lawmakers pass this bailout. We unknowns are going to STOP SPENDING. So big deal you say. But bear in mind that we're the ones who are under no pressure by banks. We're not slaves to the debtor. Some years back, we saw some very bad things in the future and have more or less prepared for a siege of sorts.

What we have coming if the Senate passes this bailout is a siege. It's a waiting game. The question that they have to answer is.... can they print enough money to get things going before we've waited them out? This is a hugely important question! Call what I'm talking about a boycott. Call it what you want. I'm just telling you what's going to happen.

If we simply don't buy any extras and really buckle down tight, the impact is going to be enormous. If our lawmakers pass the bailout, this is what we will do. We won't do it in retaliation, or in hatred though. We'll do this simply because it's a logical response to what we believe will be the result of the bailout.

So far, all the "money" that they've dumped into the subprime collapse, AIG, and others hasn't amounted to any lasting positive effect. We simply believe based on the past that this bailout will be the same. Dumping money into problems inspires NO CONFIDENCE and it certainly does nothing for the hearts of those who defaulted on mortgates, for WHATEVER reason! Except that this bailout will hyperinflate our money, and then because we do what we do in defense of this and as a self preservation reflex...we'll see a collapse that would have been far less pronounced if the geniuses in D.C. had simply left it alone.

We can only warn them. It's up to them to listen, comprehend, and then act accordingly. I personally think they're drunk at the prospect of passing this bailout, but if they do, I give this nation six months before we have a situation that will make the prospect of moving to a third world country seem like a step up.

Every unknown who reads this will know in his/her heart that what I'm writing has merit. Everybody else should be afraid enough to call the Senate in ad-nauseum because your lives are going to change drastically very soon if they're permitted to get away with this.

Community Reinvestment Act of 1977 notes.

[Kowdawg]

I finally made it through to Texas Senator John Cornyn’s San Antonio office. Washinton office is constant busy signal.

Young man said he was answering the phone about every 5 seconds! Calls are like 75 to 1 asking Cornyn to vote no.

Keep it up Texas!

[hiredhand]

I can't call from where I work, but my wife and daughter called our legislators earlier. From what I understand, they are quite stressed with trying to keep up with calls and hearing people say

NO BAILOUT!

[Eyes Unclouded]

Ron Paul got some play this year. Had this crisis not been hidden in boardrooms during the primary season he would be our nominee.

[mysterio]

Dear America :

Remember the slippery slope we told you about? This is it. Have a nice ride down.

Sincerely,

Libertarians

[oblomov]

>>Where is the constitutional scholar Sheets Byrd?

Out taking a constitutional.

[randomhero97]

Lol. Exactly right and add to the fact that this slippery slope is going to turn into a free fall with the Obamam administration.

[djsherin]

***Not only are they moving towards Socialism but now they have trashed the Constitution.***

Trashing the Constitution... that boat sailed in 1933.

[djsherin]

They don’t care. They know the Constitution has been interpreted into oblivion. It’s a meaningless document except for vote grabbing in today’s political landscape.

[djsherin]

Exactly right. Why anyone is acting surprised is beyond me. It’s not as if many conservatives have cared much when Bush walks all over the thing. After all, it was he called it “just a goddamn piece of paper”. As long as we’ve got an R, f*** the Constitution!

[djsherin]

The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Constitution is a good one to. I’m reading that now. Scary how far we’ve drifted.