[mnehring]

I would love to see your source on this. Studies like the Miele and Grasso studies have shown that, while there are some genetic traits that impact intelligence, they are not distinctly racially passed, more related to individual family groups, and this still doesn’t overcome environmental impacts. At that, the infamous the Milwaukee Project pretty much debunked the blanket ‘racial’ difference argument.

[Gay State Conservative]

I know pretty much nothing about genetics but I know a little bit about medical research and the “nature vs nurture” question.When deciding a “nature vs nurture” issue one method they use is to study identical twins raised apart and adoptees in general.Have any such studies been conducted in connection to intelligence?

[gleeaikin]

I have long been interested in racial matters having taken Genetics and Heredity in college many years ago.

My German ancestry mother has a geneology created all the way back to the 11th Century predominantly in East Prussia. On the other hand my blond, ice blue eyed, red headed husband was astonished when his mother told him shortly before she died that he is 1/16th American Indian. Since there was Mongolian Tartar in my ancestry I then realized it made sense that one son has dark hair and swarthy coloring and definitely looked like he could have Indian blood. The other son with medium brown hair and fair skin has high cheekbones and almond eyes. He had an epicanthic fold when he was a baby. He is now married to a woman from Puerto Rico, who knows she has Taino Indian in her ancestry. Both their children look very Latino.

A number of the most vicious Nazis had a grandparent or great grandparent who was Jewish. Regarding the influence of environment, there is the fascinating new science of epigenetics, wherein they are discovering the affect of environmental factors on the expression of genes in such subjects as weight gain, cancer, etc. They have found environmental differences in twin studies with epigenetics.

[freespirited]

I would love to see your source on this. Studies like the Miele and Grasso studies have shown that, while there are some genetic traits that impact intelligence, they are not distinctly racially passed, more related to individual family groups, and this still doesn’t overcome environmental impacts.

Take a look at ANY large data set. The military intelligence data; NAEP scores; SAT scores (not the best choice since it is not the most representative sample). Every time you will see a one std deviation difference between white and black test-takers. It's a fact of life whether we like it or not.

At that, the infamous the Milwaukee Project pretty much debunked the blanket ‘racial’ difference argument.

I would like to think I am conversing with someone who understands that one study proves nothing. Especially when it is the only study to get the results reported. AFAIK, no other study has been able to duplicate the results. If I missed something, there are still far more negative studies. And how practical was Milwaukee? IIRC, the gains in IQ cost something on the order of 25K per IQ point.

An example of a contrary study: the Minnesota Adoption Study. When black infants were adopted into white households they did not end up enjoying the same IQs as the white siblings with whom they are raised. Benefits were shown initially, but they were unfortunately transient. By their teen years, the effect was gone.

I have learned to accept the advice of Philip Dick. "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."

(Stickin' with my 50/50 estimate BTW.)