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Hey...Kindergarten is cheaper than Harvard...but just barely
patton | 2/26/2007 | patton

Posted on 02/26/2007 8:20:35 PM PST by patton

This morning, I was waiting with my five-year old daughter at the bus stop, for her daily commute to Kindergarten on the cheese wagon. Our golden retriever waited with us, being her usual hyperactive self.

While we waited, two things of note happened - first, there was a spectacular car wreck at the light a block down the street. Cops arrived in mere moments, the ambulance a few minutes later, as they should. Good for us - we have excellent city services. Prayers for all involved - I hope their injuries are not too serious.

Then, a city work crew showed up, lined their trucks up across from the bus stop, and proceeded to offload their equipment.

The bus was delayed by the car crash, so while the police sorted things out, we watched the city crew get to work.

Snowblowing the city park.

"I beg your pardon?", you are thinking.

Snowblowing the city park.

Hmmm. Perhaps we have too much government.

Anyway, Kelly got on the bus, and I went on with my day, with a burning curiousity about what, exactly, we are paying for, in our little Virginia city of 10,000 residents.

A web search was in order.

First, the schools - we have a city-wide K-12 enrollment of 1863 kids. Dividing the schools budget by that number, we spend $21,000 per kid for education each year.

But wait - we just built a new school, at a cost of $30.8 million. I called the city comptroller, and he informed me that loan is being paid off like a mortgage, at about $3m per year. Add another $2000/kid each year, as this is in the city budget, not the school budget. Hmmm.

Armed with this tidbit, I glanced at the rest of the city budget, to see what else was in there.

Another $2000/kid per year, for things like maintenance of the school rec fields, by the parks department.

So, from what I could find on the web during lunch, sending a kid to kindergarten in Falls Church, VA, costs about $25,000 per year, per kid.

I could not find data on the mandatory-until-12-years-old after-school daycare, or on the assorted fees paid directly by parents (e.g., I paid $150 for my 17 year old to park at the HS), and, ironically, the cost of snow removal from the schools.

But let us assume this averages another $1,000/kid, per year.

We are in the ballpark of $26,000 for a kid in kindergarten.

For reference, Harvard tuition is $30,500 per year. So public school kindergarten in my city is cheaper.

But just barely.

The very exclusive private school Al Gore attended in DC, when his dad was a Senator, currently charges $19,000 per year.

Wow. That is cheaper than kindergarten in Falls Church!


TOPICS: Education
KEYWORDS: vouchers
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To: firebrand

Sooo - you are comfortable with the idea that PS tuition is about the same as that at Harvard?

Bunch of begowned PhDs teaching your kids KG class?

Published research going on?

Or are we wasting a PILE of money?


41 posted on 03/01/2007 3:34:27 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: linda_22003

If you look up thread, I posted a bunch of rates from local elite schools in the DC area.

Only one cost more than public school. (I want a pony! LOL)


42 posted on 03/01/2007 3:37:29 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: patton

I think it's an outrage! I'm comfortable with the fact that tuition payments are over for me. I was just pointing out that public schools have at least a bit more of an "excuse" for gouging us (bloated bureaucracy, plus not a lot of charitable contributions).


43 posted on 03/01/2007 3:40:57 PM PST by firebrand
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To: firebrand

So why don't we fix that? Would you give money to a charity with 61% overhead?


44 posted on 03/01/2007 3:43:45 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: patton
I think the answer lies in privatizing-out parts of public school operations and thereby making it subject to the laws of competition between suppliers. Not just physical services but curricula as well. Philadelphia has done it--with varied success, but the system can be improved.

I believe the public-school system is too huge for our children's education as a whole to be improved by charter schools and vouchers--they will always be a drop in the bucket, as the intense competition for charter schools shows. We should instead work within the public-school system to make it successful.

We also don't want thousands of different philosophies separating us as a people. Who knows what's being taught at the This World Is Ours charter school? I know that the larger public schools are overrun with leftists, and that needs to be remedied as well.

45 posted on 03/01/2007 3:57:16 PM PST by firebrand
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To: patton

what are you paying in local taxes per year?


46 posted on 03/01/2007 4:07:29 PM PST by xsmommy
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To: firebrand

You have completely passed over the point, that the worst public education available is substaintially more expensive than the best private education, including horsebackriding and whitewater rafting.

Still want your kids in public school?


47 posted on 03/01/2007 4:08:19 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: patton
LOL. I haven't "passed over the point" at all. I said it's even more expensive because it involves a bureaucracy and doesn't get charitable donations in any meaningul way. I'm suggesting a solution. How is that "passing over the point"?

And no child of mine has ever gone to a public school. I paid the price for a better education, but it shouldn't have to be that way. In fact, it can't be that way for 99% of us.

Take a look at Chris Whittle's book Crash Course. It's full of ideas. If you don't like some of them, you might like others.

48 posted on 03/01/2007 4:15:06 PM PST by firebrand
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To: firebrand; patton

he's preaching to the choir here. those of us with kids in private school have known this all along and that's why we opted out of the gov't schools. and other people figure, hey i pay my taxes and my kids go to school for "free". Fairfax Co. VA is one of the best school dists in the country. i haven't and wouldn't send my kids to public school if YOU paid ME.


49 posted on 03/01/2007 4:22:19 PM PST by xsmommy
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To: xsmommy

xs, I am proposing to pay you NOT to send your kids, and me, too.

Taxes on the house are about $7K. don't know what else I pay, still digging it out.


50 posted on 03/01/2007 5:25:53 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: firebrand

I will look for the book - I love to read. ;)


51 posted on 03/01/2007 5:27:14 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: patton

well you get off pretty cheap then educating 3 kids for $7 k per year. i understand the principle behind vouchers. it is not a subject that is new to me : )


52 posted on 03/01/2007 6:57:29 PM PST by xsmommy
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To: xsmommy

Yes, I do, if you reckon the cost is $78k/year.

But that isn't the point - I want to offer every parent, $20k, and say, send them to Madeira, Visitation, St. James, St. Anselm's, Flint Hill, Congressional, whatever.

Just get them out of city schools, so we can save 7k per kid.

And, I would keep open one city school, for those who wish it.

Let them compete.

We could go from, "We have excellent city schools," to, "We pay you $20K for any private school you like."

And the city would save $6k per kid.

What a selling point!


53 posted on 03/01/2007 7:07:00 PM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: healy61
My son is going to Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Daytona Beach, FL. We pay nothing. For his first year there various subsidies paid about $40K of his bill. He has about $20K in student loan debt.

Before he decided on ERAU, he was accepted at both Hillsdale College in Michigan and Patrick Henry College in Virgina. He made a quantum leap from majoring in constitutional law to aeronautical engineering. One of those things you can do when you are 18 or 19 and have no responsibilities besides yourself.

I think the discussion about college costs has to take into account all the scholarships and government money that are available out there. Last August Newt Gingrich had a program on FOX about the rising cost of college tuition, and it's all because of the subsidies that are available whether the student is needy or not.

So the question really needs to be--does Hillsdale take federal loan money to pay for tuition? And the answer is--No. They do offer private scholarships. And they are less expensive then you may imagine. As I remember, Hillsdale charges around $18K a semester.

54 posted on 03/01/2007 8:54:03 PM PST by MBombardier
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To: patton

the point is, this is NOT a novel concept, it has been around forever and has gotten nowhere.


55 posted on 03/02/2007 4:23:18 AM PST by xsmommy
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To: MBombardier

my daughter will be attending the University of Dallas in the fall. it is a small conservative Catholic university and also takes NO fed money. it is $30k+ per year, but she has received merit based scholarships that will cover about half of that. She only applied to small conservative private schools, and at each, got offers of merit $ to equal about half of the tuition they charge. so i agree, i think the private universities and colleges stay competitive by offering scholarship $, to those students they really want to attract. She IS going the constitutional law route, in all probability, and i would say there is ZERO chance of her making a switch to aeronautical engineering! ; )


56 posted on 03/02/2007 4:31:42 AM PST by xsmommy
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To: xsmommy

Agreed - except I got it on Page 2. LOL.


57 posted on 03/02/2007 4:33:28 AM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: patton

of that widely read periodical the FCNP? LMAO!


58 posted on 03/02/2007 4:35:22 AM PST by xsmommy
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To: xsmommy

of that liberal snot rag, the FCNP. I am gonna have to have my phe disconnected. LMAO!


59 posted on 03/02/2007 4:39:14 AM PST by patton (Sanctimony frequently reaps its own reward.)
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To: patton

i'll tell you what, you get that red diaper baby, Nick Benton, to sign on with your proposal and i will give you props, but short of that you are flogging an idea that we have supported for 14 years, when our oldest first entered catholic preschool. your oldest is the same age, and you are just NOW thinking this is a brilliant idea? you can see why i think you are a johnny come lately with a not so novel concept!


60 posted on 03/02/2007 4:55:10 AM PST by xsmommy
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