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Shame of the Yankees - America's Worst Anti-Jewish Action [Civil War thread]
Jewish Press ^ | 11-21-06 | Lewis Regenstein

Posted on 11/21/2006 5:23:06 AM PST by SJackson

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To: spacecowboynj
the south would've never seceded in the first place were it not under great pressure to do so. and i don't mean slavery. this was so beyond that. men like Jefferson Davis, Lee, Jackson et al did not do this because they were some slave-mongering "masters" - this had to do with money.

Yeah right.

941 posted on 12/04/2006 3:52:53 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: Non-Sequitur

There was very little rebellion. Why else would peace commissioners go to Washington? If Lincoln had accepted the status quo, there would have been NO WAR. That is a fact.


942 posted on 12/04/2006 4:03:11 AM PST by TexConfederate1861 ("Having a picture of John Wayne doesn't make you a Texan :) ")
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To: Non-Sequitur

Sure. And you expect a rational government to allow a warship to invade their major port? NOT.......


943 posted on 12/04/2006 4:05:48 AM PST by TexConfederate1861 ("Having a picture of John Wayne doesn't make you a Texan :) ")
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To: Non-Sequitur

Yes, that is true, but given what he had to work with, he was remarkably efficient for his day.


944 posted on 12/04/2006 4:07:25 AM PST by TexConfederate1861 ("Having a picture of John Wayne doesn't make you a Texan :) ")
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To: TexConfederate1861
There was very little rebellion. Why else would peace commissioners go to Washington? If Lincoln had accepted the status quo, there would have been NO WAR. That is a fact.

The status quo was federal troops manning their fort. That was the status quo that Davis couldn't accept and what he was willing to start a war to upset.

945 posted on 12/04/2006 4:09:28 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: TexConfederate1861
Sure. And you expect a rational government to allow a warship to invade their major port? NOT......

Not when they had such nice plans in place to bombard the fort into submission, if they didn't starve them into surrender first. The troops in Sumter had taken not a single aggressive, or even remotely hostile action against the South. The South had taken several aggressive steps against the fort. The onus for the war lies with them.

946 posted on 12/04/2006 4:11:09 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: TexConfederate1861
Yes, that is true, but given what he had to work with, he was remarkably efficient for his day.

He had a simple job, all things considered. He took the U.S. postal system in place, jacked up the rates, and watched as his territory shrank. It's not like he started from scratch. Anyone could have done it.

947 posted on 12/04/2006 4:12:22 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: TexConfederate1861
I really doubt it. And remember, Lincoln could have cared less about the slaves, so that is not even an issue in this discussion.

I think that Lincoln's expenditure of effort on behalf of the 13th Amendment showed how much he cared. But regardless of Lincoln's attitude many southerners, with good reason in my opinion, saw the CSA as government of the slaveowners, by the slaveowners, for the slaveowners in which the servitude of the poor white slaves only differed in degree from that suffered by the black slaves.

948 posted on 12/04/2006 5:51:54 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Non-Sequitur

No one should have to accept a Foreign Power occupying a fort in their main harbor.


949 posted on 12/04/2006 6:14:23 AM PST by TexConfederate1861 ("Having a picture of John Wayne doesn't make you a Texan :) ")
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To: Non-Sequitur

Wrong. If Lincoln had not attempted to re-supply, The South would not have attacked Ft. Sumter. Anderson would have been forced out in a matter of a few days. Lincoln had all the cards, and he played them.


950 posted on 12/04/2006 6:16:02 AM PST by TexConfederate1861 ("Having a picture of John Wayne doesn't make you a Texan :) ")
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To: Non-Sequitur

It wasn't that simple.


951 posted on 12/04/2006 6:16:45 AM PST by TexConfederate1861 ("Having a picture of John Wayne doesn't make you a Texan :) ")
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

My Cattleman Ancestor didn't seem to have a problem with it.
He owned no slaves at all.
Texas had slaves, but only in limited areas, mainly East Texas, and the Brazos River Basin Areas. I have said it before, but in Texas, the popular support for secession, regardless of what the Ordinance said, was the idea that right or wrong, Texas would determine the future of slavery, or any other matter, for itself. Texas saw interference from the North and resented it.
Those 60,000 men who served from my state, had other concerns than slavery.


952 posted on 12/04/2006 6:22:27 AM PST by TexConfederate1861 ("Having a picture of John Wayne doesn't make you a Texan :) ")
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To: James Ewell Brown Stuart
Mr. Franklin is right

Great find. Thanks for the heads-up.

953 posted on 12/04/2006 6:38:46 AM PST by laotzu
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To: TexConfederate1861
No one should have to accept a Foreign Power occupying a fort in their main harbor.

Why not? Cuba does.

Charleston wasn't their 'main harbor'. It was the third or fourth busiest port. The fort had done nothing to interfere with traffic into or out of the harbor. In fact, the only interruption to shipping was caused by the rebel batteries.

954 posted on 12/04/2006 6:38:49 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: TexConfederate1861
If Lincoln had not attempted to re-supply, The South would not have attacked Ft. Sumter. Anderson would have been forced out in a matter of a few days. Lincoln had all the cards, and he played them.

Bombarded into surrender or starved into surrender, either way the south was bound and determined to have the fort, consequences be damned. How is that 'maintaining the status quo'?

955 posted on 12/04/2006 6:42:47 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: Non-Sequitur
Cuba does

Har!! Funny.....good one.

956 posted on 12/04/2006 6:48:31 AM PST by laotzu
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To: laotzu
Har!! Funny.....good one.

Gitmo sits astride the entrance to Guantanamo City harbor, one of the major ports for Cuba. To date Castro hasn't seen the need to bombard the marines there into surrender, though some seem to think he would be within his rights to do so.

957 posted on 12/04/2006 6:53:52 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: TexConfederate1861
If Lincoln had accepted the status quo, there would have been NO WAR. That is a fact.

If it were about the status quo, the Confederates would not have shut down the food supplies for Anderson and his men.

958 posted on 12/04/2006 6:59:00 AM PST by Ditto
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To: Non-Sequitur
Castro hasn't seen the need to bombard the marines there into surrender

It is not because he "accepts" it, "hasn't seen the need", or because he's a reasonable guy. Those marines would clean his clock.

959 posted on 12/04/2006 7:02:34 AM PST by laotzu
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To: laotzu
It is not because he "accepts" it, "hasn't seen the need", or because he's a reasonable guy. Those marines would clean his clock.

If only Jefferson Davis had been as smart as Fidel Castro.

960 posted on 12/04/2006 7:14:02 AM PST by Non-Sequitur
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