Posted on 07/22/2006 4:18:08 PM PDT by TommyDale
Now, this is BIG !
I'm opening up a bottle.
Has anyone seen a sleazier group of people than the Durham Justice League?
Me like
What did she say to you?
Here's the reply I got (Can I call em or what?):
I don't see the connection to the Duke case only that some officers are involved in same two incidents. The below relates to a totally different incident. as I'm sure they are also in someway part of other cases.
So no, I don't think I should unlock the thread and spend all that time w/fighting again.
I haven't gotten a reply yet, but I think CW will soon be proven wrong as this story gets out.
I don't see the connection to the Duke case only that some officers are involved in same two incidents
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I disagree. This is big. First of all, Gottlieb is in charge of the whole lot - he has like 6 investigators under him. Gottlieb's the BOSS.
Some reports have these two men (Clayton and Gottlieb) involved in the Cab-Driver fiasco, where a 3 year old misdemeanor warrant was served on a critical witness in the Duke case - when someone has already pled guilty to the crime and been sentenced. The Cab-driver, who is poor, sat in jail until a neighbor came forward and offered to bail him out. There is confusion as to which investigators were involved - wonder why it's so hard to get the truth in this investigation, is it because the people where the facts originate are lying and deceiving?
MOST IMPORTANTLY THOUGH - is that these guys are the ones that did the investigation and collected all the evidence. That signed affadavits that swayed Judges, etc.
Clayton - and others - were involved in the illegal questioning of the players at their dorms without their legal counsel.
Gottlieb - executed the only thing that ties these men to the ghost crime - the LINEUP! That was Sgt Mark Gottlieb!
Gottlieb secretly called NBC and tried to get photos from the party through the backdoor, when the Defense Lawyers were desparately trying to get Nifong to look at them.
Prior to this Gottlieb has come under fire by the Defense team for misleading Judges in order to show probable cause and obtain search warrants - and possibly the Grand Jury
These guys will be on trial now - if you throw out evidence collected and produced by them - there is absolutely no way to proceed.
I did open a bottle. It looks like you were forwarding someone's comments - and they are NOT yours.
Sorry - the post stands but should be directed at whomever passed you those comments. I have no idea who CW is?
thanks
CW=Coldwater=CourtTV moderator
Yes he was the one I just read over 26 May Motion by Cheshire
Mar 21 Clayton signature on the Evans ID no match
4 April Clayton was at the 3rd Photo ID where she picks Reade & Collinn
May 3 Himan had Inv Soucie & Clayton goes over the Power Point Presentation
May 8 Det Himan meet with Nifong and Inv Clayton on how they wanted to pursue this investigation
May 10 Inv Claton particpated in the arrest of Cab Driver
Cheshire was making on point one the lack of notes of this meetings. Clayton has his dirty hands in this!
also I think Gottlieb & Clayton served the warrant on Kim they she talks to Himan & leaves out the It's a Crock Remark in her written statement
Clayton conducted an earlier lineup in the case. The one where CGM didn't pick any.
I have mixed feelings about Gottlieb's being involved in this. It's bad for DPD, but what if his duke report turns out to be favorable to the defense? This could taint it bad.
This incident is, at a minimum, worse than what Finnerty did.
There was at least one slur - contact - and a beating. The man was surrounded by many men. The Police officers should be held to a higher standard than a 19 year old college kid.
I'd be willing to bet Nifong was burning up his cell phone talking to the Raleigh District Attorney - like I believe he did with the US Attorny in DC regarding Finnerty.
It is on record, by the way, that the US attorney in DC said that he prosecuted FINNERTY because the case was similar to the DUKE case. YES, he did.
So, if Finnerty's DC shadow boxing and mouthing off was similar to the Duke case - then I guess the men investigating the Duke alleged crime have alleged committed a crime just like the one they're investigating !!
PER U.S. Attorney in the District of Columbia .
Cheshire and Osborn will bring it all on - including the U.S. attorneys comments on the similarities between the Duke crime and the Georgetown shadow boxing.
This is going to be good.
Marco is the man ! Thanks
I don't know if it's already been posted - but the N&O has it up :
http://www.newsobserver.com/145/story/463277.html
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Marco: Gottlieb executed the entire LINEUP on 4/4.
"Defense lawyers are taking aim at the police lineup procedure requested by Nifong.
On April 4, LEAD INVESTIGATOR Sgt. Mark Gottlieb sat the accuser down in front of a large computer screen to view a series of photographs, according to Gottlieb's report on the procedure.
Gottlieb wrote that he told her that she was going to sit at a table and "look at people we have reasons to believe attended the party."
He then displayed each head shot on the screen for one minute, followed by a blank screen, followed by another head shot, and so on.
This identification process led to the indictment two weeks later of two players, Reade Seligmann and Collin Finnerty.
The lineup procedure ran contrary in two fundamental ways to the police department's General Order 4077 on Eyewitness Identification issued in February.
* Policy calls for an independent administrator to run the lineup, not the primary investigator. This avoids any unintentional influence from the investigator.
* The lineup should include five "fillers" -- people who have no connection to the case -- for every suspect, to protect against faulty identification. If an accuser picks a filler photograph, the defense is certain to challenge that witness's reliability.
Defense attorneys complain that by showing only lacrosse players, and telling the accuser that she would look only at people at the party, police sent the message to pick three of the 46 players.
"The entire process has tainted the identification," said Joseph B. Cheshire V, who represents a team captain who has not been charged. "The identification procedures are constitutionally infirm and would not stand up to legal attack."
Police aren't answering questions about the investigation. Baker, the city manager, said such complaints will be settled in the courtroom and declined to say whether any policies were violated."
http://www.newsobserver.com/1185/story/434410.html
http://johnsville.blogspot.com/
Going to town on Nifong, DPD, Cash Michaels.
"Carnival of the absurd" in Durham.
Can't hurt the Defense at all - throw it out or taint evidence - and a lack of evidence exists. Lack of evidence is almost as good.
And why is his report taking longer than some wars?
Gottlieb - LEAD INVESTIGATOR (and that's not lead like in the Durham water). SUPERVISOR of all the others.
Clayton - His buddy and sub-ordinate.
Himan - Reports to Gottlieb and has in total like 4 years experience. I read somewhere that Gottlieb is his Mentor.
Linwood Wilson - Guy has history of bad decisions and either is schitzophrenic or a corrupt liar.
The entire Defense strategy shifted on Friday, IMO.
Ok here are your marching orders:
1. Go to the DPD website.
2. Capture a picture with the largest number of DPD officers on it. [It would be good, if it included Gottleib and Clayton]
3. Construct a wanted poster that people in Durham can print out.
The First Line is:
PLEASE COME FORWARD
Here is a link to a copy but I can not read the rest of it, but it will give you a model for the wanted poster:
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/lacrosse/2006-03-29-duke-fallout_x.htm
How can the Media continue to ignore this?
One good thing in my opinion is that all the Damning comments about Finnerty are on record - and this certainly looks worse than what Finnerty did in Georgetown.
The U.S. Attorney in DC said that Finnerty was prosecuted because of the similarities between the Duke Case and the Georgetown case. By logical extension - the Lead investigator and investigative team on this supposed crime are accused of a crime similar to the one they are charged with the Public trust in investigating !
Goodness! How could you ever think those comments were mine? LOL!
I just happened to think. I would not rule out that the black cook could be subject to some pressure, even though he's not in Nifong's jurisdiction. Any thoughts on how likely that is, and how we might help him if that happens?
I'm sure Crimestoppers is on it....
I can't find the post, but I distinctly remember Gottleib adding a comment along the lines of "any interactions with the suspects". The point was that such a comment tainted the process. Does anyone remember the details?
I agree, this is a whole other situation altogether.
Finnerty is a 19 year old kid and he and his friends got into a shouting match with another group of guys and it turned violent. Finnerty didn't hit anyone and may have been hit first.
Like you said the cops made contact. And they are how old? And they're cops. They're supposed to be responsible adults. *cough*
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