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Trouble ahead for the American middle class
Free Republic | may 16, 2006 | jim shirreffs

Posted on 05/16/2006 9:05:47 AM PDT by jpsb

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To: thejokker
the "super rich" has not been re-investing their wealth in america and americans.

Unbelievable. Do you understand anything about productivity and the impact it has on our standard of living? Do you have any grasp of how capital is formed and how capital formation leads to innovation?

61 posted on 05/16/2006 10:19:24 AM PDT by Mase
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To: 2banana

"...not even Bill Gates (the richest man in America) could bail out the NYSE today.."

I think he's the richest in the world right now, but I digress. He could bail out of hte NYSE any time he wants. Life would be different, but please ..... we need him more than he needs us anymore.


62 posted on 05/16/2006 10:26:44 AM PDT by Integrityrocks
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To: Toddsterpatriot
I was certain that graph would kill this thread, or at least send the usual suspects scurrying to the PPI, not EPI, website. [smirk]

So I went there instead, and to my surprise, found this:

It is an article of faith among many liberal Democratic partisans that a significant percentage of people who vote for Republicans are willfully voting against their own class interests. They are being suckered, the argument goes, by the Republicans' disingenuous appeals on issues of cultural morality and by simplistic calls for a less meddlesome government.

Source: The Progressive Policy Institute, The Trouble With Class-Interest Populism


63 posted on 05/16/2006 10:33:54 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Integrityrocks
I think he's the richest in the world right now, but I digress. He could bail out of hte NYSE any time he wants. Life would be different, but please ..... we need him more than he needs us anymore.

Net worth of Bill Gates: About $30 Billion
Average 1 day of transaction on the NYSE: 1.8 Billion Shares worth $69 billion dollars for companies worth $22.5 trillion dollars.

No way...

64 posted on 05/16/2006 10:34:15 AM PDT by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - They want to die for Islam, and we want to kill them.)
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To: Fruitbat
I was responding to this "I don't see a link between manufacturing and the middle class" by pointing out that manufacturing was creating wealth (and a middle class) in Asia. Maybe not for the line workers but for supervisors, managers, engineers etc.
65 posted on 05/16/2006 10:37:22 AM PDT by jpsb
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To: mc6809e; A. Pole

"In other words, they gouge the American public much less than American workers."

I don't believe I've seen another freeper who is more consistently anti-American in their posts than mc6809e. I want to thank this poster for his/her consistency and showing what many globalist/free traders think.


66 posted on 05/16/2006 10:37:37 AM PDT by brownsfan (It's not a war on terror... it's a war with islam.)
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To: Lunatic Fringe

Cool. That would go nicely with my Gus Hall/Jarvis Tyner 1976 campaign poster.


67 posted on 05/16/2006 10:37:44 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: 2banana; oblomov
JP Morgan bailed out the NYSE, not the US treasury.

According to this, he did both.

In 1907 Morgan quelled a stock market panic and a national financial crisis by organizing fellow private bankers to bail out the US Treasury, providing funding as well as designating distribution of their financial aid. Morgan also used his international interests to stabilize the gold standard, and when the stock market hit a crisis, facing early closure when the exchange could not cover trading, Morgan's influence and reputation enabled him to call together fellow financiers and furnish the exchange with $20 million (organized in 10 minutes) to keep Wall Street trading from collapsing.

John Pierpont Morgan, 1837-1913

68 posted on 05/16/2006 10:39:09 AM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
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To: 1rudeboy
I was certain that graph would kill this thread, or at least send the usual suspects scurrying to the PPI, not EPI, website. [smirk]

PPI....EPI....Communist.....Socialist....

69 posted on 05/16/2006 10:40:51 AM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
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To: jordan8
"You misidentify the ruling class, a common mistake"

I undersand your point and you are correct, but I prefer to call these people the servants of the ruling class. While not entirely true, it does tend to help my argument and there is a lot of truth in it too.

70 posted on 05/16/2006 10:41:10 AM PDT by jpsb
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To: jpsb

If Bush gets his way with immigration policy adding over 100 million+ people in the next 20 years, there will only be the peasant class workers and the ruling class rich that control them that will be left in this country. The middle class will eventually (50 years or less) being squeezed out.


71 posted on 05/16/2006 10:51:58 AM PDT by Buffettfan (VIVA LA MIGRA! - LONG LIVE THE MINUTEMEN!)
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To: jpsb
That is true, but why are the products producted by the factories formerly located in the usa allowed into our market without a correction for the wage advantage gain by thier new location.

That is selective, Pat Buchannan-like, protectionism. I'm not sure how you would even enforce such a tarriff. If Ford is punished for moving a plant to Mexico, by imposing a tarriff on Ford products imported from Mexico, then what's to prevent Ford from re-labelling and selling their products to a middle-man to avoid the tarriff? What's to prevent Ford from establishing a front company in another country?

On the flip side, should we subsidize foreign companies that build factories in America (with non-union labor) like Toyota and Honda?

72 posted on 05/16/2006 10:52:38 AM PDT by kidd
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To: kidd

Protectionism worked very nicely for most of our history. What is wrong with protecting our industries and our workers?


73 posted on 05/16/2006 11:01:41 AM PDT by jpsb
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To: jpsb
What is wrong with protecting our industries and our workers?

How did protectionism work out for Argentina?

74 posted on 05/16/2006 11:04:02 AM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Protectionism worked very nicely for most of our history. What is wrong with protecting our industries and our workers?


75 posted on 05/16/2006 11:24:20 AM PDT by jpsb
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To: 1rudeboy; Toddsterpatriot; Lunatic Fringe
I was certain that graph would kill this thread...

It would have if this had been a thread concerning money and people.   Reality has no place here, this thread is just a good old wobbly thread from our college days.   Just like old times --hey gang, let's all sing together.

♪♫♪"and the banks are made of marble, and there's guards at every door.." ♫♪♫

76 posted on 05/16/2006 11:24:44 AM PDT by expat_panama (There are 10 kinds of freepers; them that manage numbers with a computer, and them that don't.)
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To: jpsb
What is wrong with protecting our industries and our workers?

Let's stop Toyota from selling Americans quality products. It's unfair to GM and the UAW.

77 posted on 05/16/2006 11:28:40 AM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
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To: jpsb
Protectionism worked very nicely for most of our history. What is wrong with protecting our industries and our workers?

United States' history is one of global trade going back to before Washington's administration.   The patriots rioted in Boston against tea protection and that started the war of independence.   The first US embassy was set up in Holland to negotiate trade pacts; the idea was to open up China once Europe was on line.  To this day, it's the limp-wristed tea drinkers who need protection and it's the deep voiced imported coffee drinkers that don't.

78 posted on 05/16/2006 11:34:27 AM PDT by expat_panama (There are 10 kinds of freepers; them that manage numbers with a computer, and them that don't.)
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To: jpsb
Protectionism worked very nicely for most of our history. What is wrong with protecting our industries and our workers?

Horse and buggies worked well, too... So did slavery... and allowing only white land-owners to vote...

Welcome to the 21st century. It's a global economy now... make yourself useful and you will succeed.

79 posted on 05/16/2006 11:34:37 AM PDT by Lunatic Fringe (http://ntxsolutions.com)
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To: expat_panama

80 posted on 05/16/2006 11:37:26 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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