Michael Schiavo had 2,800 days to fulfill Terri's wish to die, but he did not

March 22, 2005 | First_Salute

[First_Salute]

If, what Michael Schiavo is saying, is true, and his claim is supported truthfully by his brother and sister-in-law, regarding the statements that they allege to be made by Terri, and the Florida probate court has "found as the fact" of the case, that:

"she would not want to live this way,"

then please, to examine a calendar, for every day, of every week, of every month

• from February of 1990
• on through all of 1991
• on through all of 1992
• on through all of 1993
• on through all of 1994
• on through all of 1995
• on through all of 1996
• on through all of 1997
• on into 1998.

For, on each day of nearly 2,800 days, Michael Schiavo DENIED Terri's wish to "not live like that," and he DENIED her all of those days, her right to die.

Instead, he kept her in suspended animation, that now, is described by his allies, as "torture" but only applicable to the facts of the case --- the time frame of the case --- that they now want to visit.

How come, such parties who are now for her "being put out of that misery of 'not living like that,'" have no comment on all those hours, days, weeks, months, and years?

Such parties now for her death, cannot seem to focus upon that simple fact, that the courts DID NOT do their duty in Florida, which is to try and enforce HER wishes to die. It took them eight years to figure that out? That is "due process?"

They are experts at that, speeding up your exit from Florida, by fereting out of families and friends, your wish to die, and if necessary, finding such "facts" in the heresay of people within earshot of the destined to be soon deceased [this means you and you're slip of the tongue].

Probably the question is asked, by probate judges across Florida, a few dozen times each day:

"IS THERE A 'LIVING WILL?'"

Probably, such probate courts ask for the details of such a will; and probably, while reviewing such a will ---and if necessary, finding facts by asking questions of the surviving spouse --- the courts will rather quickly find in all that inquiry, the wishes of the incapacitated party; but the courts in Florida failed to make an effort to know for nearly 2,800 days, while Michael Schiavo said nothing about Terri's wish to die.

Indeed and to the contrary, there was this court proceeding, a lengthy trial in Florida, wherein Michael Schiavo championed Terri's right to live and how much he would dedicate himself --- even study nursing --- to care for her for the "rest of her life." This court proceeding wherein he never gave an inkling that would betray to the jury, his knowledge that she really wanted to die, lest that affect the outcome of the trial and her need for all that money.

How bold of him.

She did not want to live. She did not want any therapy. She did not want any food. She did not want any water.

She did not want that shunt in her body, that bleeds off the excess brain fluid from around her brain, that has been squeezing upon the cells of her cerebral cortex, so that her cortex would appear to be less than desired in a healthy young woman her age --- and is still now, a cortex that is indeed there, but members of the media declare in editorial after editorial, that she has no cortex at all, and thus no cognitive ability, and thus no personality. (There are so many institutional experts on that!)

What a "life," what a horrid existence, but the fact is, that she got that way, by being denied her right to die, day in and day out, for nearly 2,800 days ... by her husband.

Who, despite her suffering, and after he had won for her right to live, approximately $1,600,000 meant, both, for the purpose of improving the quality of her life, and for his pain and suffering known as a "loss of consortium" --- Michael Shiavo THEN waited several more years until he miraculously announced in 1998, via his attorney, George Felos, that Terri had wanted to die. Which tidbit of law, did not go on the record as testimoney until a trial in 2000.

How is it, that Michael Schiavo and his many fellow adversaries of Terri's continuing "existence," (the A.C.L.U., is of course interested in this partial life abortion) ... cannot seem to attend to his gross denials of her right to die, and the gross denials of due process that were the duty of the courts of Florida to enforce?

Terri may die here, around tax time, but Michael Schiavo and certain of his cohorts, are responsible for having kept her alive, imprisoned, suspended without the ability to cry out to anybody, that she DID NOT WANT TO LIVE THAT WAY.

Terri was kept alive against her will for a longer period of time, by her husband, than the period of time that her husband's complaints, seeking her death, have been in court.

How come, Michael Schiavo is "credible," after being incredible all those thousands of days?

Justice delayed, is justice denied due process.

    

[First_Salute]

Do we have a Radiologist on board?

The dark area is supposed to be liquid, gone, missing Is there someone on here who really knows how to read this thing?

IIRC, one of you is a radiologist. Can you offer any opinion from one slice of Terri Schiavo's CT scan?

Sorry for the late reply. I did not log in on Saturday.

The "dark areas" are the CT density of Cerebral Spinal Fluid (CSF).

The larger butterfly-shaped area in the center is CSF within the right and left lateral ventricles. The other serpiginous areas are CSF in the subarachnoid space collecting in the sulci and in the fissures of the brain.

The amount of fluid in the vetricles is increased indicating Hydrocephalus.

The bright area within one of the ventricles would be expected to be a portion of a Ventriculoperitoneal Shunt to alleviate the hydrocephalus.

The brain tissue also shows cortical atrophy which increases the potential space between the brain tissue and that space is the filled up with CSF.

The degree of atrophy increases with age and all of us who actually lived through the 60's have some degree of cortical atrophy. The degree of cortical atrophy, however, is definitely abnormal for a woman her age

Be that as it may, you really can't make any clinical judgments as to her mental capacity just by the degree of hydrocephalus and atrophy.

I often see patients with that degree of hydrocephalus with a ventriculoperitoneal shunt in place that are doing just fine.

In addition, many elderly patients with that degree of atrophy that are doing well for their age.

Grandma might not be the sharpest pencil in the family box anymore once she gets to that degree of atrophy but you would be killing off trainloads of Grandmas if you used that degree of cortical atrophy to decide when to end their lives.

[First_Salute]

The CT scan image is located at the same website that also maintains a timeline of events (that is being updated with some legal events, yet leaves out the obvious, for each day listed, that Michael Schiavo denied his wife's wishes). The parents' website also maintains a timeline of events.

So that you can quickly see the sources:

http://www.miami.edu/ethics2/schiavo/CT%20scan.png
http://www.miami.edu/ethics2/schiavo/timeline.htm

http://www.terrisfight.org

Re: reply 21. [Top of the image.]The CT scan clearly shows the presence of some cerebral cortex that is under pressure by spinal fluid, the brain cells being squeezed a bit, a condition known as hydrocephalus, and otherwise the cortex has atrophied some, but it is not "totally gone."

Because of "aging," people have some varying degree of cortical atrophy later in life, and the bio-chemical causes remain a major research problem. Yet, in Terri's case, immobility --- the suspended animation that Michael Schiavo had imposed upon her, by not honoring her wish to die (according to him and Judge Greer), all those days, leading to months and then on up to eight years --- has accelerated her cortical atrophy.

Michael Schiavo, given his assertion is true, that "she would never would want to live like that," denied her wishes for nearly 2,800 days. In addition, he kept that information, along with his brother's and sister-in-law's knowledge of it, to him, and their, selves.

That, also, through the time period of not telling the jury in the malpractice suit(s), that she wanted to die --- no, instead, he told them, that he would dedicate himself to her living, and so, he eventually received for himself and for her, combined, a net exceeding $1,600,000.

Hydrocephalus can be caused by a restriction of flow down your spinal column, and the compression fracture at L1 in Terri's lumbar curve, could be the problem. That would be the compression fracture that occurred somewhere around the original incident in February 1990.

Discounting all the other indications of "trauma" that have been reported, and given a patient with her history, an MRI of her complete spine should have been done THEN. A side-view MRI scan of the spine, can show the restricted splinal column flow.

It may be, that Terri indeed, did just plain "collapse." A good neurologist would want further revelation: MRI; because you would want to know where there might be the mechanical restriction.

Some of the problem, there, is that shrinkages and atrophy in parts of the brain, remain so much a mystery and problem for researchers, that there are, of course, people who will simply not consider the mechanical possibilities, unless there has been a mechanical - traumatic accident. This "school" of doctors and researchers lean toward answering the bio-chemical mystery, instead of pursuing that and the bio-mechanical mystery.

Whether or not Michael had anything to do with her collapse, the doctors should have done, and still should do, an MRI.

Because it is possible that she somehow managed the original L1 compression fracture, and soon, during the weeks leading up to her "collapse," the backup of spinal fluid flow, began to affect her brain and stem ... leading, in her case, because of the stress in their married lives, to a triggering event.

Yet, the failure by Michael, who knew CPR, but he did not provide her with CPR, even though "only a few seconds" transpired from the moment he heard the "thud" in their apartment, until he was at her side ... remains as another indication of how he has a track record of denying her.

Some shrinks like to call that, "abandonment."

All in all, it may still be, that he "just plain skipped all the sensitivity training" that is required for maintaining a loving relationship. Probably most members of this forum, can testify to that!

Yet, his failure to act promptly on her behalf, whether CPR or respecting her wish to die, in early 1990, is, as they like to say, "eggregious" at the least.

The Florida probate and appeals courts' playing along with and then usurping that game, is repugnant to our Constitution.

Eight years, he kept her imprisoned before he acted upon her wish to die. Incredible.

[First_Salute]

My points are, that if you give Michael Schiavo the "benefit of the doubt" regarding her wishes, he did not act in defense of her wishes.

The crowd that is worried about being trapped in suspended animation, and so they are arguing in his favor of now ending her life, wishes to ignore the timeline during which he failed to honor her request.

The crowd that is worried about being trapped in suspended animation, and so they argue that they do not want outside interference against their wishes (I agree), still cannot face the fact that Michael did not comply as they now wish to imagine that their spouse or guardian would.

The crowd that is worried about being trapped in suspended animation, envisions that they will be only held in suspended animation for some few days or perhaps a couple weeks, but the Michael Schiavo standard for honoring your wishes to "not live like that," is to NOT honor your wishes until AFTER a 2,800 day time period.

[SeaBiscuit]

"You should send this to a few newspapers..."

Well done!

BTTT

[tioga]

he didn't have the money yet.

[First_Salute]

Bump.

[First_Salute]

At: Doctor: The "Water" in Terri’s Brain is a Myth [CT Scan Found As Well As Bone Scan Of Terri] - posted to FR on March 23, 2005

FRPR Toskrin, who is a neurologist, had this to say about the CT scan:

I'm a neurologist and have read hundreds of CT scans. Two problems with this scan are that there is no name on it and it is only a single image of the multiple image complete CT scan.

That being said, I don't see any cortex on this CT image. There is white matter but the normal "cortical ribbon" that surrounds the white matter is missing.

[First_Salute]

I had thought, that her CT scan was not as bad as others have claimed, and so, that accounts for my humble opinion about what it shows, in all the above; which I qualifed or mitigated or whatever, with reply 27, preceding (that I found, this morning).

Yet, the gist of my argument, that the husband's credibility is almost nil, is supported by the endless blur of many days and months and years during which he did not act upon her wishes that he claims to be true.

In every personal example that has been cited on this forum, of a member's involvement in "pulling the plug," none has stated that they delayed for years, yet among the tellers of these stories, the most adamant cannot bear to face the nightmare of time that Michael Schiavo denied his wife's wish.