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Thread Four: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1332664/posts |
Posted on 12/30/2004 7:01:16 PM PST by HairOfTheDog
Free Republic has a lot of horse people that have found each other on other threads…. And since we all like to talk horses, how about a thread where it is not off-topic, but is THE topic?
This is a horse chat thread where we share ideas, ask for input from other horsemen, and talk about our riding and horse-keeping. We have a lot of different kinds of riders and horses, and a lot to share. In the previous threads we have had a great time talking through lessons, training, horse lamenesses, illnesses and pregnancies... and always sharing pictures and stories.
I always have a link to this thread on my profile page, so if you have something to say and can't find the thread in latest posts… look for it there and wake the thread up!
I also have a ping list for horse threads that are of interest, and Becky pings everyone most mornings. Let Becky (Paynoattentionmanbehindthecurtain) and/or me know if you would like to be on the ping list. As FreeRepublic is a political site, our politics and other issues will probably blend in…. There are many issues for horsemen that touch politics… land use, animal rights/abuse cases that make the news…. Legislation that might affect horse owners.
So... like the previous threads, this is intended as fun place to come and share stories, pictures, questions and chit-chat, unguided and unmoderated and that we come together here as friends. There are lots of ways of doing things and we all have our quirks, tricks and specialties that are neat to learn about.
Thanks. I've read that in the rule book, but couldn't remember the particulars. That's why a Quarter Horse can be registered with both the AQHA and the APHA but a paint can only be registered with the APHA.
It's 43 out here.... We actually started leaving the horses outside this week.... figuring, if we were gonna start having this early spring, they didn't need to be in! We're actually expecting it to remain dry and lows in the 40s for the rest of the week. It's weird phenomenon, January is usually our coldest month.
That's the reason in a nutshell but there is lots more to it. In the early 1960's there were two paint horse associations, the American Paint Stock Horse Association and the American Paint Quarter Horse Association. They merged to form the American Paint Horse Association.
Lots of interesting reading, if you like paints, in the books "The American Paint Horse" by Glynn W. Haynes and the book that the paint horse association puts out called "The American Paint Horse, A Photographic Portrayal".
This is interesting:
Several years ago a Paint Horse that resulted from the mating of two registered Quarter Horses was an outcast because he could not be registered in their association. The authenticity of the breeding was also questioned by some horsemen who did not understand that a few of their finest horses carried recessive paint genes, and sporadically the action of these genes was exhibited in one of the foals. The Paint crop-outs were usually gelded, sold or disposed of to avoid embarrassment to the owner and futile explanations. It made no difference what names could be found in their pedigrees; they were of little value to their owner, and their selling prices were no more than those of good-grade stock horses.
Oh my gosh, I didn't know that but it makes sense because one of my neighbors, a few years ago, had the ugliest, dumbest chocolate brown lab I had ever seen. He must have been one inbred son-of-a-gun.
I also didn't know the crossed eyes in Siamese cats were a result of messed up breeding. I always thought it was normal and really cute.
If you have RFD TV, right now Pat Parelli is working with a beautiful tobiano paint and he's buckin' like a booger.
The dog on the left belonged to a friend... The dog on the right is my Logan, who was not small, he was actually an inch taller than the preferred height in the standard.
There's a couple different trends going on.... one, breeding for large, moose looking dogs that some think are better, stronger dogs for hunting. (I don't think they have any better endurance at all) and the other, breeding from a very small chocolate gene pool. There seem to be a lot of huge gangly chocolates ;~D
We don't get that channel!
Oh - and that dog was also dumber than a box of rocks ;~D
Sweet, but slooooooooooooow.
You know, what made my neighbors chocolate lab so ugly was his eyes and head. He had a huge square head and sunk eyes.
Your friends lab in the picture has those ugly eyes.
I have a black lab that has beautiful brown eyes. It's kind of disconcerting because they look human. She's not a great dog, though. Just your regular run of the mill lab.
I've never seen a horse buck like that, except for in the rodeo. He's training a young horse and he has him saddled and teaching him to lunge. It's funny because the horse will be leading along quietly, then suddenly go into a bucking frenzy. I'd hate to be the first one on that horse! His next show, ol' Pat is supposed to be on that horse.
The loose eyelids are one of the common issues with those dogs. That dog's father was a field trial champ who had his eyelids tightened up surgically so he had nice pretty eyes in his pictures. Of course... that didn't fix the gene pool.
The eyes are important. Focusing on one trait to the detriment of all others is the mistake that is repeated again and again when people get involved in selective breeding. There are many many good breeders... but there are also many who think if they can corner the market on this one thing, they'll make the bigger bucks.
I wish we got TV like that... We get very few horse-events on TV here... a rare show-jumping event, and sometimes I can catch the AQHA show "America's horse".
(1) Limited gene pool for chocs. Folks who want an all choc litter have a real problem because the available animals for breeding may not be the best.
(2) Field trial folks breeding for the big dogs. I don't think it's necessary to get a good field trial dog, it's just one of those rumors that gets started. (Just for contrast's sake, the "rumor" among Golden Retriever breeders is that the "little red dogs" make the best field trial dogs.)
My choc is a beautiful, neat little girl who is actually 1/2" under the AKC standard height . . . but when we measured her in AKC she roached her back up a little . . . so she's officially 21 1/2" tall in AKC, but in USDAA she's 19 3/4" tall . . . luckily! (USDAA height class changes at 20 inches).
She is an odd breeding (I call her my illegitimate child) because her sire is a Show or Conformation Lab while her mother is all field trial breeding. She got the small size and short-coupled build from her dad, and the slenderness and drive from her mom. Her mom's dad (NFC AFC Storm's Riptide Star) is the only choc ever to win a national field trial title, and he is a big rangy dog. Her dad is a champion who throws all three colors, and her litter was about half and half black and chocolate (IIRC, 5 black and 4 choc).
She certainly is not ugly, although she's a little too light in build behind for a conformation dog and her ears are a little too big (a trait thrown by her maternal grandsire along with a funny little bump on her nose).
Shelley (sorry I don't have a pic of her "stacked" - I'm at work).
Shelley's dad, Can. CH Sumo Simbra Black Bordeaux - your typical small solid show dog
Shelley's maternal grandsire - your typical big rangy choc. What's funny is that his pedigree is solid black for 5 generations back, he's just an outcrop from a "nick" - i.e. a couple of hidden genes on different branches of the pedigree that just happened to pop up chocolate.
In this case, the back breeding to a conformation type produced a dog with better type but still retaining the field ability. Good compromise IMHO - she also won't eat you out of house and home (45 pounds).
Yup....
Well,I just learned some new stuff. I don't know a thing about any type of show dog. I do watch the Kennel club shows on the animal channel because the dogs are so pretty. I have a blue heeler, lab, and 2 miniature schnauzers but they are all just one step above a mutt and the mutts are probably better dogs! I love them all, though.
This Lab is my very first dog, so I'm really just applying what I learned as a Siamese breeder in the dog world. The basic principles are the same, and it appears to be the same for the horses. I've never been involved in horse breeding although I've studied a lot of racing pedigrees . . . I would love to breed Gracie but she's a little on the old side (19).
I still think those cross-eyed siamese cats are cute. :)
The horse racing industry would be a BLAST to be involved in and I would love to do it. My horse dentist, Mike Robbins, used to be a racehorse trainer but he sticks to buying weanlings and yearlings at the Fasig-Tipton sales, mostly in Kentucky, brings them home, takes care of them and resells them as 2 year olds. He's buying really high dollar thoroughbreds, though, in the $25,000 range, and I'm not willing to blow that kind of money on something I'm not totally familiar with. And he buys a bunch, he never puts all of his money into one horse.
If you Google "mike robbins" you'll see lots of stuff on him. He even has training videotapes that you can buy off the internet. I didn't find all of this stuff out until after I'd known him for awhile. I was shocked when I found out this stuff, he seems like your regular, run of the mill cowboy.
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