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Posted on 12/30/2004 7:01:16 PM PST by HairOfTheDog
I didn't know this. I just put mine out but they were out anyway m-sat 10-3. We haul in hay so the grass probably nor much.
As long as they are used to grass, it shouldn't be a problem. It's only if you throw a horse out on a field who isn't used to grazing 24/7. But even starting them out again, I'd be careful.
It shouldn't be a problem if they are just penned up a few days for bad weather though should it?
Nonono. It's only a problem if they are taken off it for a few months, or longer, and then are put back on it. A couple of days will be fine.
Yeah, but what I mean is that I've never heard of a horse foundering without an associated episode of colic, either before or during. I've also never had anybody give me a realy good layman's description of what actually causes founder, have you? I think it has something to do with having too much food in stomach, which allows undigested food to pass on to the small bowel where it causes some kind of problem that I can't remember which results in too much of something getting into the blood which causes swelling of the laminae in the hooves which cuts off the circulation to them and eventually kills them causing them to allow the bones in the hoof to rotate or drop. Now I may be totally wrong about all that, but that's as close as I can get to it off the top of my head. Feel free to jump in there at any time and correct me.
I've heard of people heading off a possible episode of founder by tying a horse in a really cold creek for several days. I guess it's kinda like putting ice on something to bring down the swelling coz it's the swelling that causes the damage. I don't know if some kind of anti inflamatory drug to reduce the swelling would work or not. Beaker would know more about that.
HMMM. Cold a vasoconstricter though. I would have thought heat. So it's the swelling that gets them. I thought it was circulatory. Do they make cold packs for hoofs?
Putting a horse in cold water will bring down the swelling, but the cold cold water could also kill other healthy tissue as well. So heading it off at the pass like that is a myth. I'm not really sure what drugs can be administered, as I've never delt with an episode of founder before.
Navicular?
And you may be right about the circulation vs the swelling. It's kind of a chicken or egg thing. Is it the poor circulation that causes the swelling or the swelling that causes the poor circulation. I don't know.
I don't know if the regional grasses make this much difference, but up here in the spring, they will founder long before they would colic. Here horses can founder within a day on too rich a pasture (or a break in to a grain bin for that matter). Founder is a sudden overdose of much too much protein. The protien overdose will manifest itself in laminitis and breakdown of the soft tissues of the feet. If the soft tissues break down, the coffin bone (named that for a reason) can rotate irreversably and in the extreme, come through the bottom of the foot. I'm surprised, given the lushness of the pasture I've seen in Inge Cav's property, that this isn't a problem in the south. It sure is up here. The key to avoiding founder is to cross fence if pasture is lush, or limit them to pasture for a limited time per day followed by dry lot with a bland hay through the rest of the day to balance the diet.
The hard part here with the pasture I have is that in the lush spring months, I have to worry about too much grass, and in the late summer it all dies, and every week in between is a different pasture and diet management decision based on how much rain it's had, how fast it's growing, or whether they've eaten it down and there isn't much left on it.. I only have a few weeks all year I can let them go 24/7 without any supplemental management.
I only associate colic with bad hay, molds, bad plants and toxics, usually not good grass.
Estrogen, with as much property as you have, I would think you should be able manage a pastured horse rotating between two fields of about an acre each throughout the growing season.
Have you ever read the books by James Herriot, the vet?
In of the stories they treated a foundering pony by putting him in a creek, several times a day. I can't remember how long they soaked, but it wasn't constant.
Becky
Training one to stand with a foot in a bucket can be a problem:) I can't remember where I saw it at but I remember seeing a horse stand with all 4 feet in buckets. Might have been at one of my rides. They soak legs to help combat stocking up, after alot of excerise.
Becky
Sorry, I hit post before I finished. Navicular is different than founder because it deals with the changes in the navicular bone itself. Founder deals with the lamine and the coffin bone. The navicuar bone is kind of wedge shaped and helps distribute weight evenly. It lies behind the short and long pastern bones, and in front of the flexor tendon. Navicular or navicular changes occur when the sinovial fluid that surrounding the bone dries up so that you end up with bone rubbing against bone, which causes leasions, holes and lollypop like bumps of bone on the navicular bone itself, and eventually, the bone will wear away almost completely in some severe cases. Navicular changes occur when the structure of the bone itself starts to change. That isn't necessarily full blown navicular, and is easily treatable.
I have read all those books. :-) I don't remember that part. It might help the symptoms.
It was a pony that belonged a gypsy family camping on the edge of town. The pony was the kids. The boss guy, is the one that treated it. I always thought those stories were true, right? Alot of what they say, I have learned is right.
Becky
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