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Then don't vote for third party candidates and expect anything other than a leftward turn for the country.

And why is it any less true to say it this way?

"Then don't vote for GOP candidates and expect anything other than a leftward turn for the country."

If we give Republicans our vote, no matter what leftist positions they take, then they have no incentive whatsoever to change their positions. They can have their cake and eat it too - getting votes from mushy moderates and liberals by expanding government, and keeping the conservatives on the planation with vague threats about how much worse it will be under Democrats.

That's not a strategy. At best, it's short term tactics. Well, I'm not in this for the short term. I'm in it to help keep the monster of socialist government off of my grandchildren. If I thought Republicans would help in that effort, I'd be happy to give support. But it's clear, and been clear for years, that they won't, at least not with their current leadership.

" If we give Republicans our vote, no matter what leftist positions they take, then they have no incentive whatsoever to change their positions. They can have their cake and eat it too - getting votes from mushy moderates and liberals by expanding government, and keeping the conservatives on the planation with vague threats about how much worse it will be under Democrats."

That's the point that I have repeatedly tried to make. If you promise your vote to a politician *no matter what*, then what do you expect from him? Would you let your spouse cheat on you once a week because you don't want to be single? Certainly not! Well, actually some of these people probably would.

My God, at least you'd think that they would be smart enough to threaten to withhold the vote if they aren't pleased with the current coarse and don't want it to get any worse. If you ain't complaining, the pols keep doing what they've been doing. You gotta let them know that you aren't happy. And never let them know that you're scared of the alternative. Show your anger, but never show the fear. The fear only plays into their hands.

That is, if they really don't like the leftward shift. Sometimes I wonder.

this is true, but what choie is that? you either
A) get semi-moderates voted under republican votes, and they retain their positions or we can simply give a better candidate later (anyone can run you know)
or
B) we can split our votes and make the left stronger by deviding ourselves.

it makes more sense to vote on republicans until a little right of center becomes center. then vote libertarian vs republican. democrats would become a new extreme, and thus, less fo a threat.