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Filmmakers Say They Contemplated the Faith of Lord of the Rings
National Catholic Register ^ | 15 December 2003 | Steven D. Greydanus

Posted on 12/15/2003 3:19:48 PM PST by big'ol_freeper

Search for evidence on the DVD commentaries and other materials that accompany Peter Jackson’s epic film production of The Lord of the Rings. You will be hard pressed to find an acknowledgment that the work comes from a Catholic writer.

Yet Tolkien said the fact that he was “a Christian (which can be deduced from my stories) and in fact a Roman Catholic” was the most important and “really significant” element in his work. He called The Lord of the Rings “fundamentally religious and Catholic.”

Jackson and his collaborators recently took some time at a press event to contemplate the project that has occupied the last five years of their lives — as well as the cultural, moral and spiritual significance of the books that inspired it.

(Excerpt) Read more at catholic.net ...


TOPICS: Religion; Society; The Hobbit Hole
KEYWORDS: lordoftherings

1 posted on 12/15/2003 3:19:48 PM PST by big'ol_freeper
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To: ecurbh
Ping!
2 posted on 12/15/2003 3:22:01 PM PST by Lil'freeper
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To: big'ol_freeper
Cool. Thanks
3 posted on 12/15/2003 4:19:32 PM PST by Professional Engineer (...I'm not dead yet... I'm getting better. /Python)
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To: 2Jedismom; 300winmag; Alkhin; Alouette; ambrose; Anitius Severinus Boethius; artios; AUsome Joy; ...

Ring Ping!!
There and Back Again: The Journeys of Flat Frodo

Anyone wishing to be added to or removed from the Ring-Ping list, please don't hesitate to let me know.

4 posted on 12/15/2003 4:53:53 PM PST by ecurbh (There's gonna be a hobbit wedding!)
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To: big'ol_freeper
Greydanus is one of my favorite reviewers. His web site is a good resource for parents.
http://www.decentfilms.com/
5 posted on 12/15/2003 5:12:53 PM PST by Varda
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To: ecurbh
They contemplated it, but there are certainly instances in the film when they prove they did not understand it. Fran Walsh's typical New Zealand liberal worldview does rear its ugly head now and then, especially in the extended edition of the dvds.

For instance the little speech Faramir gives standing over the body of one of the bad guys they'd killed, where he implies that his motives for war were as noble as Frodos.

Her faith is 'moral equivalence' and they hate the concept of absolutes, which is the concept that Tolkien of course inculcated throughout the trilogy.

6 posted on 12/15/2003 7:31:08 PM PST by Maigret
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To: Maigret
For instance the little speech Faramir gives standing over the body of one of the bad guys they'd killed, where he implies that his motives for war were as noble as Frodos.

Well, first of all, that is not what he really says - he is musing on whether the dead guy is really bad, had been coerced or compelled to fight, or even understood what he was fighting for. And second, that passage is verbatim from Tolkien:

It was Sam's first view of a battle of Men against Men, and he did not like it much. He was glad that he could not see the dead face. He wondered what the man's name was and where he came from; and if he was really evil of heart, or what lies or threats had led him on the long march from his home; and if he would not really rather have stayed there in peace - all in a flash of thought which was quickly driven from his mind.

The Lord of the Rings, Book IV, Chapter 4 "Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
I am sure Tolkien himself encountered thoughts like this in the trenches of World War 1.
7 posted on 12/15/2003 7:46:44 PM PST by ecurbh (There's gonna be a hobbit wedding!)
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To: Maigret
For instance the little speech Faramir gives standing over the body of one of the bad guys they'd killed, where he implies that his motives for war were as noble as Frodos.

That speech was written by Tolkien -- someone who was familiar with war. Too often people allow government to dehumanize its enemies. Enemies are human too.

Then suddenly straight over the rim of their sheltering bank, a man fell, crashing through the slender trees, nearly on top of them. He came to rest in the fern a few feet away, face downward, green arrow-feathers sticking from his neck below a golden collar. His scarlet robes were tattered, his corslet of overlapping brazen plates was rent and hewn, his black plaits of hair braided with gold were drenched with blood. His brown hand still clutched the hilt of a broken sword.

It was Sam's first view of a battle of Men against Men, and he did not like it much. He was glad that he could not see the dead face. He wondered what the man's name was and where he came from; and if he was really evil of heart, or what lies or threats had led him on the long march from his home.
--J.R.R. Tolkien
The Lord of the Rings, Book 4, Chapter 4: Of herbs and stewed rabbit

As much as some would like to make him, Tolkien was no warmonger.

8 posted on 12/15/2003 7:56:53 PM PST by John Farson (Cthulu for President -- why vote for the lesser evil?)
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To: John Farson
Of course he wasn't a peacnik either... somewhere in between:

Lonely men are we, Rangers of the wild, hunters - but hunters ever of the servants of the Enemy; for they are found in many places, not in Mordor only. If Gondor, Boromir, has been a stalwart tower, we have played another part. Many evil things there are that your strong walls and bright swords do not stay. You know little of the lands beyond your bounds. Peace and freedom, do you say? The North would have known them little but for us. Fear would have destroyed them. But when dark things come from the houseless hills, or creep from sunless woods, they fly from us. What roads would any dare to tread, what safety would there be in quiet lands, or in the homes of simple men at night, if the Dúnedain were asleep, or were all gone into the grave?

And yet less thanks have we than you. Travellers scowl at us, and countrymen give us scornful names. "Strider" I am to one fat man who lives within a day's march of foes that would freeze his heart or lay his little town in ruin, if he were not guarded ceaselessly. Yet we would not have it otherwise. If simple folk are free from care and fear, simple they will be, and we must be secret to keep them so. That has been the task of my kindred, while the years have lengthened and the grass has grown.
--J.R.R. Tolkien (Aragorn) Fellowship of the Ring

War must be, while we defend our lives against a destroyer who would devour all; but I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend.
--J.R.R. Tolkien (Faramir)
The Two Towers

Of course, pre-emptive war is used by the bad guys:

For imagining war he has let loose war, believing that he has no time to waste; for he that strikes the first blow, if he strikes it hard enough, may need to strike no more. So the forces that he has long been preparing he is now setting in motion, sooner than he intended. Wise fool. For if he had used all his power to guard Mordor, so that none could enter, and bent all his guild to the hunting of the Ring, then indeed hope would have faded: neither Ring nor Bearer could long have eluded him. But now his eye gazes abroad rather than near at home; and mostly he looks towards Minas Tirith. Very soon now his strength will fall upon it like a storm.
--J. R. R. Tolkien {Gandalf}
The Two Towers bk 3 ch 5 'The White Rider'


9 posted on 12/15/2003 8:07:50 PM PST by John Farson (Cthulu for President -- why vote for the lesser evil?)
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To: big'ol_freeper
Geek Bump!!!
10 posted on 12/15/2003 10:04:22 PM PST by MayDay72 (Socialism enslaves. Free markets liberate.)
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To: Maigret
That speech appears in Tolkien's LOTR, but not as a speech for Faramir. I don't recall the exact context, but I am positive it is there somewhere. I'll try to find it...
11 posted on 12/16/2003 5:26:17 AM PST by Mamzelle
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To: John Farson
Eek--should have finished the thread before replying! should have known someone else would have the quote at his fingertips...
12 posted on 12/16/2003 5:27:10 AM PST by Mamzelle
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To: John Farson
My statement did not imply that Tolkien was a warmonger, far from it. And the statement that the screenwriters put in Faramir's mouth is NOT the one quoted here! A change of a few words makes a big difference.
13 posted on 12/16/2003 8:21:39 AM PST by Maigret
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To: Maigret; John Farson
And the statement that the screenwriters put in Faramir's mouth is NOT the one quoted here!

Transcript of the film:

Sam: We are innocent travellers!

Faramir: There are no innocent travellers in this land, only servants of the Dark Tower.

Frodo: We are bound to an errand of secrecy. Those who claim to oppose the enemy would do well not to hinder us.

Faramir: The enemy? [looks at the dead Southron] His sense of duty is no less than yours, I deem. I wonder what his name is, where he came from, and if he was really evil at heart, or what lies or threats led him on this long march from home, and if he would not rather have stayed there... in peace.

What the book says:
It was Sam's first view of a battle of Men against Men, and he did not like it much. He was glad that he could not see the dead face. He wondered what the man's name was and where he came from; and if he was really evil of heart, or what lies or threats had led him on the long march from his home; and if he would not really rather have stayed there in peace - all in a flash of thought which was quickly driven from his mind.

The Lord of the Rings, Book IV, Chapter 4 "Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Hmmm, seems pretty close to me!
14 posted on 12/16/2003 12:16:15 PM PST by ecurbh (There's gonna be a hobbit wedding!)
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To: ecurbh
I stand corrected, thanks! :)
15 posted on 12/17/2003 8:56:34 AM PST by Maigret
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To: Maigret
For instance the little speech Faramir gives standing over the body of one of the bad guys they'd killed, where he implies that his motives for war were as noble as Frodos.

Faramir muses at this point, "I wonder what his name was?" Considering the look of the troops the men of Gondor attacked, I'd say the guy's name was Kalid Mohammed al-Tikriti, or some such.

16 posted on 12/17/2003 2:56:06 PM PST by My2Cents ("Well....there you go again...")
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