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To: HairOfTheDog
Touche. Great team you had there.

I was thinking more of the short snout on modern Cockers. They used to be able to carry their own birds.

Some "breeders" down this way have started "working" on Labs. Breeding them to have a "block" head. I could care less of the dog has a rectangular skull. Is she friendly. Can she hunt well, be trained, etc. That's far more important than physical conformity to me.

/rant

thanks for listening.
8,142 posted on 01/05/2004 7:46:33 AM PST by Professional Engineer (3JAN ~ I SAW my unborn child move this morning!!)
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To: Professional Engineer
If a dog had a block head, I'd think it was a door stop.
Or as smart as one..
8,146 posted on 01/05/2004 7:57:55 AM PST by Darksheare (This tagline is out of order.)
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To: Professional Engineer
Some "breeders" down this way have started "working" on Labs. Breeding them to have a "block" head. I could care less of the dog has a rectangular skull. Is she friendly. Can she hunt well, be trained, etc. That's far more important than physical conformity to me.

The classic old Labradors did have a blocky wide head. That may be what they are trying to get back to. There was a trend for awhile among the field-trial people to breed labs taller and heavier. There were field-trial winners that weighed 100 pounds and looked nothing like a Labrador. With that (as a side-effect I think) came long narrow noses and a more hound-type head and ears. Looking back at the standard, the ideal height for males in the breed description only 24 inches at the shoulder. Logan was just a bit taller than that, and I always tried to stand him so he wouldn't look too tall and leggy, and hoped they wouldn't measure him and find he was 25". In a perfect world, both form and function are considered just the right amount.

General Appearance
The Labrador Retriever is a strongly built, medium-sized, short-coupled, dog possessing a sound, athletic, well-balanced conformation that enables it to function as a retrieving gun dog; the substance and soundness to hunt waterfowl or upland game for long hours under difficult conditions; the character and quality to win in the show ring; and the temperament to be a family companion. Physical features and mental characteristics should denote a dog bred to perform as an efficient Retriever of game with a stable temperament suitable for a variety of pursuits beyond the hunting environment.

The most distinguishing characteristics of the Labrador Retriever are its short, dense, weather resistant coat; an "otter" tail; a clean-cut head with broad back skull and moderate stop; powerful jaws; and its "kind," friendly eyes, expressing character, intelligence and good temperament.

Above all, a Labrador Retriever must be well balanced, enabling it to move in the show ring or work in the field with little or no effort. The typical Labrador possesses style and quality without over refinement, and substance without lumber or cloddiness. The Labrador is bred primarily as a working gun dog; structure and soundness are of great importance.

Size, Proportion and Substance
Size--The height at the withers for a dog is 22½ to 24½ inches; for a bitch is 21½ to 23½ inches. Any variance greater than ½ inch above or below these heights is a disqualification. Approximate weight of dogs and bitches in working condition: dogs 65 to 80 pounds; bitches 55 to 70 pounds.

The classic type, their appearance, is part of the tradition that makes them distinct and different from the other retrievers, and different from the other hunting dogs. There will always be dogs that don't look standard and can do the work just as well or better. Their working ability is important, and the best breeders look at both their talent and their appearance. The trouble with show dogs like Logan, is that for some, appearance is ~all~ they are breeding for, because it is the only thing that shows. And some of the show dogs no longer remember that they used to hunt. Goldens are increasingly that way.... The inclusion now in the Labrador standard of "other pursuits" beyond hunting is a bad sign, leading to "the aptitude to compete in the show ring" now used as a judgable part of their temperament, as important as birdiness.

8,155 posted on 01/05/2004 8:09:40 AM PST by HairOfTheDog (There may come a time when the courage of men fails.... but it is not this day.)
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