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A Senate of the States – The 17th Amendment Part II
Article V Blog ^ | December 28th 2017 | Rodney Dodsworth

Posted on 12/18/2022 6:06:58 AM PST by Jacquerie

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From December 2017.
1 posted on 12/18/2022 6:06:58 AM PST by Jacquerie
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To: 5thGenTexan; 1010RD; AllAmericanGirl44; Amagi; aragorn; Art in Idaho; Arthur McGowan; ...

Article V ping!


2 posted on 12/18/2022 6:07:52 AM PST by Jacquerie (ArticleVBlog.com)
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To: Jacquerie

When secession from the union finally becomes a reality, developing a new constitution will simply be eliminating some old amendments.


3 posted on 12/18/2022 6:11:18 AM PST by Right_Wing_Madman
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To: Right_Wing_Madman

A piece of cake…a walk through the park! If things get that far, there’s going to be much more work to do than reshuffling the Constitution and the Amendments. Who will be around to do the rejiggering?


4 posted on 12/18/2022 6:19:26 AM PST by bigfootbob (Arm Up and Carry On!)
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To: Jacquerie

The 17th Amendment is like a Cancer on the life of this system of checks and balances. Now all power in governments in the USA rests with those powerful enough to buy Congress.

For example,
1. All laws have to be approved by both Houses of Congress.
2. The January 6th quadrennial process has Congress as the final referee.
3. All impeachments/removals happen through Congress.
4. All executive/judiciary appointments no longer have the State legislatures being able to apply strong indirect advice/consent.
5. All new amendments have to be approved by both Houses of Congress.
6. Any other Article V process has to be approved every step of the way by both Houses of Congress.

As a result of not having strong check/balance on federal power by the State Legislatures we have seen the slow growth of kleptocracy corruption in the USA. It’s like a cancer. I’m not sure if it can be easily fixed.

One good thing that came as a result of the 17th Amendment was the end of Jim Crow laws. No doubt about it that the racism of the Democrats in many States was intense and despicable where they ruled with one party control. However, in place of good fixes of corruptions like that at the State level we now have a much even larger infestation of corruption and incompetence at the federal level.


5 posted on 12/18/2022 6:30:59 AM PST by Degaston (no autocrats please)
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To: Jacquerie

“Few voices advised caution, ....the senate still served its Constitutional and proper purpose, [1] to temper and cool wild proposals from the house, [2] protect the states from federal encroachment, and [3] provide wise counsel and circumspection of the president’s nominees and proposed treaties.”

All 3 things have come to pass. In terms of “1”, this seems to have accelerated with the ascendancy of Schumer to leadership. He was in the House before being elected to the Senate in 1998. He still speaks and acts more like a leftist, impulsive, overly emotional House member, and not what has now become the mythical, thoughtful, deliberating Senator.

But the quotation above begs the question why there were only a few voices back then? What were the political and cultural currents flowing through the country that made for such a weak resistance? Why did enough states ratify the 17A beyond giving a simple conclusion that states saw it as “beneficial”? Perhaps it will be explained in the other articles.

(BTW - Is there a recommended, classic, conservative political viewpoint on the history of the 17th Amendment?)


6 posted on 12/18/2022 6:32:12 AM PST by Susquehanna Patriot ( )
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To: Degaston

While I would be interested in why the end of Jim Crow is linked to the 17A. My theory is that happened because of the combination the impact of World War 2 on US society and culture, the rise of electronic media and entertainment, Brown v Board of Education, and the Voting Rights Act.


7 posted on 12/18/2022 6:38:52 AM PST by Susquehanna Patriot ( )
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To: Jacquerie
For all the charges of "smokey back room" shenanigans that may have existed when Senators were elected by the various state legislatures, at least there was a likelihood that the Senator would represent the interests of even the most podunk corners of his state.

Once it became a popular election, the only voters that mattered were the big cities. The state as a whole ceased to have representative in the upper house. And so it was that state's rights/powers were whittled away by the Beast of the Potomac.

8 posted on 12/18/2022 6:44:46 AM PST by Sirius Lee (They intend to murder us. Prep if you want to live and live like you are prepping for eternal life)
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To: Susquehanna Patriot

<>Is there a recommended, classic, conservative political viewpoint on the history of the 17th Amendment?<>

1. Click the link to this article. At the bottom are my sources.

2. At ArticleVBlog.com, search “A Senate of the States.”

You’ll find a day-by-day history at the Federal Convention of the Senate. Around twenty articles.


9 posted on 12/18/2022 6:49:22 AM PST by Jacquerie (ArticleVBlog.com)
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To: Susquehanna Patriot; All

The reasons I remember reading about as to why the 17th Amendment were:

1. The state legislators weren’t to be trusted because they were bribed by railroad execs. Likely true but why wouldn’t the railroads just now bribe the senators? Seems post-17th Amendment the railroads get off cheap - fewer bribes!

2. The state legislators were often slow in appointing senators when there was a vacancy. This I believe!

In both cases it seems it was more a people not holding the state legislators’ feet to the fire then a real structural governing problem.

Whatever the reason it upset the balance of federal-state-people power. The Founding Fathers had it right, it needs to be repeale!


10 posted on 12/18/2022 6:50:15 AM PST by Reily
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To: Reily

You are right. Repeal the 17th.


11 posted on 12/18/2022 7:17:36 AM PST by one guy in new jersey
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To: Degaston

Right. So repeal the 17th and bring it back if needed.


12 posted on 12/18/2022 7:19:10 AM PST by one guy in new jersey
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To: Jacquerie

17 was the Biggest Power Grab. Ever !


13 posted on 12/18/2022 7:32:25 AM PST by nevermorelenore ( If My people will pray ....)
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To: Jacquerie; All
TIMING IS NOW.

Following disclosures of large technology platforms, in collusion with treasonous rogue government groups, taking part in illegally removing a duly elected US President, President Trump had this to say on Truth Social:

The MAGA Movement needs awareness of why the 17th Amendment needs repealing, as well as more changes needed to strengthen the Constitution. The timing of these discussions is now ripe.

Former US Sen. Rick Santorum Joins Convention of States Project as Senior Advisor:
https://conventionofstates.com/news/breaking-sen-rick-santorum-joins-convention-of-states-project-as-senior-advisor

Enormous changes in technology are allowing a Color Revolution (note the name Norm Eisen) to occur on American soil, putting the Nation in peril.

These changes in technology used by enemies of the United States to overthrow its government in a Coup d'Etat of its 45th President and to rig results of elected offices, are now discernable.

Criminal application of current everyday technologies; computers, scanners, printers, together with easy entry (amatuer level hacking) of electronic election databases, has allowed "One Person, One Vote" to become "One Cheater, Ten Thousand Votes."

Should the American Republic survive its technological war within, the aftermath calls for a multi-year commission to investigate causes and for needed changes to be identified. These changes must accommodate the People’s demands via Article V to repeal existing Amendments, and possibly propose new Amendments, all purposed to strengthen the Republic and guard against attacks on its institutions and elections.

More discussion of need for repealing the 17th here:
https://freerepublic.com/focus/chat/4117108/posts?page=52#52

Eye-opening revelations of Stealth attacks using everyday technology and processes used in a takedown of the American Republic were brought to light by 1st Generation Polish-American Kristofer Jurski and are referenced here (study carefully):
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/4106441/posts

14 posted on 12/18/2022 8:04:43 AM PST by Hostage (Article V)
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To: Hostage

Imagine if President Trump came to the same conclusions.

The next logical step would be for him to lead the states to an Article V COS.


15 posted on 12/18/2022 8:50:13 AM PST by Jacquerie (ArticleVBlog.com)
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To: Susquehanna Patriot
(BTW - Is there a recommended, classic, conservative political viewpoint on the history of the 17th Amendment?)

Here is one... I'm searching for others that I know I read before.

The Seventeenth Amendment and the Death of Federalism

-PJ

16 posted on 12/18/2022 10:38:54 AM PST by Political Junkie Too ( * LAAP = Left-wing Activist Agitprop Press (formerly known as the MSM))
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To: Susquehanna Patriot
Here are the other respected papers on the history of the 17th amendment by George Mason Law School professor Todd Zywicki:

“Senators and Special Interests: A Public Choice Analysis of the Seventeenth Amendment,” Oregon Law Review (1994) (scroll down to the text).

“Beyond the Shell and Husk of History: The History of the Seventeenth Amendment and Its Implications for Current reform Proposals,” Cleveland State Law Review (1997)

-PJ

17 posted on 12/18/2022 10:56:32 AM PST by Political Junkie Too ( * LAAP = Left-wing Activist Agitprop Press (formerly known as the MSM))
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To: Reily
Here is a more thorough analysis of "why" the 17th Amendment:

A Senate of the States - The 17th Amendment Part I of II.

18 posted on 12/18/2022 1:29:08 PM PST by Jacquerie (ArticleVBlog.com)
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To: Susquehanna Patriot

Putting the election of Senators up to popular vote was helpful in being able to get some of the nefarious activities out of the smoky rooms and into the open. Thus, in the northern states, a groundswell of support for overthrowing Jim Crow era laws was possible more quickly. But, yes compared to the impact of WW2 and electronic media/entertainment it didn’t make as much difference. I don’t know if we would’ve gotten Brown and VRA as fast without the 17th Amendment.

What the 17A should’ve done at the very least was make it possible for State Legislatures, in accordance to State Law, to terminate early the term of a Senator who isn’t representing their States, and to appoint another to serve out the remainder of their term.

What we’ve ended up with on the 17A now is proving to be like a horrific cancer that’s going to destroy the Constitutional Republic of 1789 unless something is done to firmly restore having in place some firm check/balance on federal power. In the meantime the march towards totalitarianism keeps making steady progress.


19 posted on 12/18/2022 4:44:09 PM PST by Degaston (no autocrats please)
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To: Jacquerie; Degaston; Susquehanna Patriot; Sirius Lee; Reily; one guy in new jersey; ...

https://scholars.law.unlv.edu/facpub/350/
Ulysses at the Mast:
Democracy, Federalism,
and the Sirens’ Song of the Seventeenth Amendment
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(click the ‘download’ button if you want to read the entire 74 page pdf file)
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Excerpt:
Starting at page 40 of the pdf file, (marked as page 538)
III. B. Motivation for the Seventeenth Amendment
1. The Corruption of State Legislatures
2. Deadlock and Delay in the Election of Senators.
3. Populist Sentiment.
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Do you think 60 senators would ever propose to “undo” this?
The ONLY way to undo it is with an Article V Convention Of States.


20 posted on 12/19/2022 6:32:56 PM PST by Repeal The 17th (Get out of the matrix and get a real life.)
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