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I am a Southerner
http://civilwartalk.com/threads/i-am-a-southerner-i-wont-apologize.13443/ ^

Posted on 04/14/2016 9:36:26 PM PDT by NKP_Vet

I am a Southerner...

I won't apologize I won't be reconstructed. I will not surrender My identity, my heritage. I believe in the Constitution, In States' Rights, That the government should be the Servant, not the Master of the people. I believe in the right to bear arms, The right to be left alone. I am a Southerner... The spirit of my Confederate ancestors Boils in my blood. They fought Not for what they thought was right, But for what was right. Not for slavery, But to resist tyranny, Machiavellian laws, Oppressive taxation, invasion of his land, For the right to be left alone. I am a Southerner... A rebel, Seldom politically correct, At times belligerent. I don't like Lincoln, Grant, Sherman, Or modern neocon politicians like them. I like hunting and fishing, The Bonnie Blue and "Dixie" I still believe in chivalry and civility. I am a face in the Southern collage of Gentlemen and scholars, belles and writers, Soldiers and sharecroppers, Cajuns and Creoles, Celts and Germans, freedmen and slaves. We are all the South. The South...My home, my beautiful home. My culture, my destiny, my heart. I am a Southerner...


TOPICS: Education; History
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To: DoodleDawg

Good article about black slave owners. Lots of info on William Ellison.

http://slaverebellion.org/index.php?page=the-black-slave-owners


61 posted on 04/15/2016 9:49:54 AM PDT by NKP_Vet (In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle,stand like a rock ~ T, Jefferson)
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To: Georgia Girl 2

I’m having to re-think it. I mean, do Germans have monuments to Hitler?


62 posted on 04/15/2016 10:46:14 AM PDT by Bodleian_Girl (Governor Bentley must resign!)
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To: central_va

I’m not looking at it from a racial angle so much as a human suffering angle.

Reading about Thomas Jefferson’s bi-racial children who had it easy no doubt. But the whiter ones had to leave the breast of their family, never to be heard from again.

Then the regular slaves, mothers watching their children sold away. People bought and sold like cattle. I just can’t pretend anymore that God smiled on that and didn’t smite the South.


63 posted on 04/15/2016 10:52:33 AM PDT by Bodleian_Girl (Governor Bentley must resign!)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

I see what you did there!


64 posted on 04/15/2016 10:56:09 AM PDT by Bodleian_Girl (Governor Bentley must resign!)
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To: Pelham

Feel free to ask him.


65 posted on 04/15/2016 11:25:10 AM PDT by Secret Agent Man (Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: Bodleian_Girl

Are you from the South? If so you should be aware of the rich and gracious culture of our region. Slavery was a national disgrace not a Southern disgrace. Many, many people in the North owned slaves until after the War between the states ended. I am very proud to be a Southern woman and would never want to live anywhere else and I’m going to be very vocal about attempts to destroy Southern heritage. It is what it is.


66 posted on 04/15/2016 11:28:35 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped)
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To: NKP_Vet

Bookmark


67 posted on 04/15/2016 11:40:12 AM PDT by kosciusko51
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To: Georgia Girl 2

Yes, I am from the South. My people have been here since 1725, starting in North Carolina, then after the War for Independence, they came through the Cumberland Gap to receive Tennessee land grants awarded to soldiers.

Forebearers on my mother’s side fought at Little Round Top and previous to that were some of the first settlers in Tuscaloosa, traveling in a wagon train of like minded Believers down the Federal Highway from SC.

Back to my dad’s side:
After the Civil War, and after the land played out, they came to work in the mills in Huntsville, AL.

I love my heritage but there wasn’t any slave owning I could find in my genealogy research except for two people that I found who had one slave listed.

So I guess I don’t really feel an attachment to the slave owner/plantation situation because it wasn’t a part of who I came from.

I am distantly related to John Chisum and if memory serves he owned slaves but I think he also had black out of wedlock children.


68 posted on 04/15/2016 1:19:38 PM PDT by Bodleian_Girl (Governor Bentley must resign!)
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To: Bodleian_Girl

Then you have nothing to feel bad about. Most people in the South did not own slaves.


69 posted on 04/15/2016 1:30:38 PM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped)
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To: Bodleian_Girl

You do realize that slavery has been a part of African culture for thousands of years between opposing tribes don’t you? It wasn’t invented just for early America and white people. In fact it was practiced all over the world. You do realize that slavery still exists don’t you?

“I just can’t pretend anymore that God smiled on that and didn’t smite the South.”

Very presumptuous on your part to know the will of God and guess what, we’re still here. Slavery was a part of life throughout the Biblical world and who are we to say how God’s will works. Look at the stories of Hagar, Joseph, Onesimus and who doesn’t know the story of Moses. God used all these slaves for a purpose.

I haven’t seen too much of a desire to migrate back to their country of origin by black folks since the Civil War ended, have you? I’d be kissing the ground and thanking my ancestors for getting me off of that continent.

“Then the regular slaves, mothers watching their children sold away. People bought and sold like cattle.”

That is still going on today all over the world and even in the dark ugly underground of America.


70 posted on 04/15/2016 1:35:24 PM PDT by MagnoliaB (You can't always get what you want but if you try sometime you might find, you get what you need.)
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To: ml/nj; rockrr
Do you think we had the attitude that the British forts and/or any land within the States belonged to England on or after July 4, 1776?

Funny you should mention that.

The Revolution ended in 1783 with the Treaty of Paris. The British didn't leave Fort Detroit until 1796, after Jay's Treaty was ratified, even though Detroit was in US Territory after the Revolution. Same thing with Fort Mackinac.

We didn't go to war with Britain over that, though. One reason was that Indians controlled the land US troops would have to cross to get to the forts, but still, we weren't as given to saber rattling as the secessionists were.

FWIW, Trudeau (and Cruz) don't appreciate the author's ripping off Moulson's "I am a Canadian" speech.

71 posted on 04/15/2016 1:46:53 PM PDT by x
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To: MagnoliaB
Very presumptuous on your part to know the will of God...

It's just an opinion, but it seems to be there is a higher calling for those who have a knowledge of the Scriptures (Southerners), than those that do not. (Tribal and Muslim cultures that are not enlightened.)

72 posted on 04/15/2016 4:27:17 PM PDT by Bodleian_Girl (Governor Bentley must resign!)
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To: Bodleian_Girl

I didn’t mean that in a harsh way.


73 posted on 04/15/2016 4:44:50 PM PDT by MagnoliaB (You can't always get what you want but if you try sometime you might find, you get what you need.)
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To: MagnoliaB

It’s ok, I enjoy discussing it.

It’s still something I’m trying to flesh out for myself in a way.


74 posted on 04/15/2016 4:58:51 PM PDT by Bodleian_Girl (Governor Bentley must resign!)
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To: Bodleian_Girl

It’s good you’re seeking. You’ll figure it out.


75 posted on 04/15/2016 5:08:44 PM PDT by MagnoliaB (You can't always get what you want but if you try sometime you might find, you get what you need.)
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To: Bodleian_Girl

I am descended from the 5 Ray brothers that got ran out of Scotland after the Battle of Culloden. They settled in North Carolina, around what is now Fayetteville. Back then it was called Campbellton. They were all proud Jacobites. My GGGGG grandmother was Catherine Ray, daughter of Donald Ray, one of the brothers. She married William Black, also from Scotland. Their GG grandson was Duncan Black, 15 NC Infantry, my GG grandfather. He was present for duty at Appomatox when Lee surrender. He was born in 1844 and died in 1919. My grandmother (his granddaughter) was born in 1897 and died in 1975. She told all her grandchildren about him and how he fought alongside his brother Daniel, who was KIA at Bristoe Station, VA in 1863. On my father’s side I have a great Uncle Travis Porter, 3rd NC Infantry, who was captured on the 3rd day of fighting at Gettysburg and transferred to Point Lookout POW Camp in Maryland, where he died in that hell-hole in Dec 1863. I have many more Confederate ancestors and have been a member of SCV for many years.


76 posted on 04/15/2016 6:39:29 PM PDT by NKP_Vet (In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle,stand like a rock ~ T, Jefferson)
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To: NKP_Vet

I loved that family history!

My people received one of those land grants from Lord Granville on my dad’s side and arrived in 1725, and on mom’s side they were followers of John Knox who later married up with Huguenots.


77 posted on 04/15/2016 7:30:48 PM PDT by Bodleian_Girl (Governor Bentley must resign!)
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To: NKP_Vet

Nice family tree. I have worked on mine since the 70’s when it wasn’t very easy. Now it’s so much easier with the internet, but it’s hard to find the time.

One branch is Scotch-Irish and settled in the Appalachian mountains in the 1600’s. I don’t know if the records exist for another branch since so many court houses burned in Virginia during the war and other times too. I haven’t done in depth on a couple of branches but even those seem to go back to the early days of this country formation. I’m sure there are indentured servants in my family tree.


78 posted on 04/16/2016 2:15:49 AM PDT by MagnoliaB (You can't always get what you want but if you try sometime you might find, you get what you need.)
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To: Adder

my point is that this 3/5ths invalidates the entire constitution in the eyes of the unwashed/uneducated. and it is cannon fodder for the left. white man privilege bs on down the line. it was a mistake to have anything related to slavery in the constitution. it would have been a protection for the document. long gone.


79 posted on 04/16/2016 2:29:34 AM PDT by kvanbrunt2
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To: x; ml/nj; rockrr; Laser_Ray; NKP_Vet; DoodleDawg
x: "The British didn't leave Fort Detroit until 1796, after Jay's Treaty was ratified, even though Detroit was in US Territory after the Revolution.
Same thing with Fort Mackinac."

Thanks ml/nj, rockrr & x for bringing this subject up again, since I've long searched for a complete listing of those.
Now, by my count there were at least eight British forts in four US states & territory from the time of the Treaty of Paris in 1783 until the Jay Treaty in 1796 -- 13 years!

In New York:

  1. Fort Niagara
  2. Fort Ontario
  3. Fort Oswego
  4. Fort Oswegatchie
In Michigan:
  1. Fort Mackinack
  2. Fort Detroit
  3. Fort Lernoult
In Ohio: Fort Miami
In Pennsylvania: Possibly Fort Presque Isle (?)

This map also shows several other British forts in the US during that time, but so far I can't find verifications for all of them:

The subject can get confusing since some reports say the Brits were still in Fort Mackinac in Michigan during the War of 1812, and you have to look elsewhere to learn that they did indeed abandon that fort in 1796, only to reoccupy it after President Madison declared war in 1812.

Another questionable fort is Presque Isle in Pennsylvania, which is listed in the Treaty of Paris link, but not on the Jay Treaty link.
Interestingly for this discussion on Fort Sumter is the fact that Fort Miami in Ohio was built by the Brits after they promised to leave in 1783, only finally abandoned in 1796.

Again, the point of all this discussion is: a foreign power having forts on US territory, even after they've promised to leave them, was not considered a casus belli by our Founding Fathers.
Instead, they patiently waited for negotiations to resolve those forts, 13 years later.

80 posted on 04/17/2016 2:04:08 PM PDT by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective...)
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