Posted on 07/05/2015 8:22:49 AM PDT by JJ_Folderol
Abel Reyna (AR) and Sgt. Patrick Swanton must have been sweating cold as they blitzed the media with apocalyptic visions of SAMCRO and the Mayans stabbing, shooting, and raping their way across Central Texas Marketplace during church hour, with the heroic police saving the day. But it was showtime, and the news cameras were already rolling. And thus, the "biker shootout" meme was born.
Very sad to say that I know fellow conservatives who in their hearts, believe the narrative. They've internalized it and consider alternatives to be tin-foil. It's a sledgehammer alternative in any case -- a very hard truth to accept about America's new rules. Hard as a rock. Truth is like that, and people avoid it sometimes.
They see it with the reassuring narrative and know themselves that really bad biker human trafficking extorting kidnapping thieving meth-peddling slime criminals do in reality exist (they do, in tiny numbers comparatively).
Besides, the idea that the rules of play have become so perverted as to allow more than 150 law-abiding people of no criminal record have lives broken and a felony arrest on record -- that such a crazy thing could happen with America watching -- well, that's just crazy. A lot of conservatives think the narrative isn't crazy, so it must be the other.
I'm afraid Waco was a pretty good success. At least they didn't provoke the folks arrested into rioting in the "secure facilities." Thank God they kept cool heads.
So from my POV, it was a new-age 4th of July, yesterday, whether folks realize it or not, the gauntlet's down. Driving across cityscape right at the fireworks hour last night, I saw more blasts of sparkling confetti fireworks than I've seen in many long years. It was almost eery.
One thing “we” can be sure of is that you are useless troll.
X=has been.
Spurt=drip under pressures.
FYI, I keep count, and actually, of people on this forum who've expressed an opinion one way or the other on Waco, at last count, folks who think the cops' story stinks, are more than twice as many as those who buy the police story. It looks different because that minority, less than a third, posts in huge volume so its presence looks larger. But actually, most of the few FReepers who are following it, anyway, are smart enough to see through the crap.
But I suspect that the reason such a vast number of FReepers haven't paid attention, is because like me, they happily took the hook, line, and sinker with just the headlines and got a chuckle out of it! A 150 of 'em arrested after a shootout leaving nine dead, serves those bastard bikers right! Ha ha!
It's a pretty comfortable place to leave it. It's where I left it for a couple of weeks until I noticed a few favorite FReepers musing it, then I did a little research. It hit me like a sledgehammer and I reeled for at least three weeks. I feel wrung out like a washrag, now, but see there's nothing more than to press on.
bad biker human trafficking extorting kidnapping thieving meth-peddling slime criminals do in reality exist (they do, in tiny numbers comparatively).
That’s exactly right. Even the ones who do participate in criminal activity, not all members do, and very seldom do they interact with the general public.
I grew up (back fences touched) behind a guy who would become East Coast Chapters President of Hell’s Angels. Never, not once, did I ever have a seconds trouble from him or any of his brothers. As a matter of fact they kind of pseudo adopted me (I was a fat kid), and toughened me up. Taught me how to stand up for my self.
So needless to say I see bikers in a different light than the media idea of them.
I also understand what the 1%er patch means, and I ain’t gonna mess with em either.
Thing is I don’t doubt they were fighting. If you want a fight with a guy wearing colors, he’ll give you the best you ever had. I believe the cops either overreacted and responded with weapon fire, when tear gas would have done, or they were ordered to do permanent damage because they were becoming too big, or too powerful.
The reaction afterward was total CYA.
“there’s nothing more than to press on.”
Powder dry, eyes open, brother!!
That would presuppose that the 18 (at least) cops already present had sophisticated insider knowledge to be in the right place at the right time.
Those same sophisticated insiders and law enforcement gang professionals, weren't aware that the vast majority of bikers present were average Joes and Janes? Some of them arrested even having zero bikes, let alone club affiliation or criminal history?
I have as much contempt and regard for law enforcement as anybody. But I don't underestimate LE folks' intelligence, whether its contempt or praise. There was intelligence in this thing, not incompetence, and the only panic I thought I saw was in Swanton's abrupt fade.
“Who did fire the shots?”
Everyone says the bikers fired first.
“On another level, this was the first demonstration of a “legal” way to forcefully suppress freedom of association among patriots.”
Er, you mean a demonstration on how to stop a gang gun fight?
” when tear gas would have done”
LOL! You don’t take tear gas to a gun fight!!!!!!!
If you read what you wrote you will see it is you that brought up the ‘ordained minister’ excuse. Now you trying to run away from that fanciful drift?
Where are you getting your information? Sounds like don’t0’s fiction.
You, me and anyone else with a CHL will be arrested on SUSPICION if we happen to be at a shooting where 9 were killed and 20+ wounded. You naively think Conceal Carry is Get Out of Jail Free card?
Why would you think the WPD or Da’s office is obligated to release any information on an ongoing investigation?
Most of those arrested have been released without charges, bond reduced and released charged or are unable to make bond. Give one name of someone not yet released and not charged.
I have no issue with defending non-criminal’s Constitutional Rights. I do have a big problem with some here making unsubstantiated claims of Rights being denied, but seem to never have any specifics on the Rights denied.
I have a big problem with (apparent) law abiding conservatives here trying to use dis-information and false Constitutional claims to give cover and excuses for criminals that routinely deny everyone else their Constitutional Rights to not be terrorized, intimidated, endangered in public, murdered, or have blatant drug dealing and prostitution in their communities.
Anyone here or elsewhere that excuses or give cover to anyone who participated, in any degree, with the Waco shootout, are fools, and foolishly bring disdain and a bad reputation to this important conservative forum. I do not suffer fools well!
” I do have a big problem with some here making unsubstantiated claims of Rights being denied, but seem to never have any specifics on the Rights denied.”
Don-o ran like a rabbit when I challenged him to discuss specifics.
Post and run seems to be his SOP.
So far none of the gang supporters are willing to stand and debate the FACTS. With no facts on their Excuser side, its a tough job to debate the facts and a lot easier to make some personal attack and run. The don’tO “don’t know” syndrome.
Actually I have been fairly instrumental in shorting out numerous bike gang sympathizer apology threads by making you fools debate the facts, turn to personal attacks or run and hide. This one will soon be on the growing list.
By the way, you stole my description of x-spurt. Hell, ya can’t even be original on personal attacking.
Want to keep playing? I’m game!
I haven’t run away from anything. I just stated it’s not my business or anyone’s business what the guy was ordained as. My statement stands. An ordained minister, and many others without criminal records were arrested on BS charges, held in jail under ridiculous bail, denied access to council for almost a month.
Plenty long enough for the Police, ATF, and the DA to all get their stories to match. You don’t think that’s enough of a violation of their rights? Let a police force do that to a black person and see what happens.
I don’t naively think anything about my CCW permit. I know exactly what the rules are. I used it as an example of how the government will ignore any right that doesn’t suit them at the time. Most of those guys were arrested carring pocket knives. According to the media they were arrested for “Dangerous Weapons”. No they were arrested for association. Freedom of Association is there in the First Amendment I believe.
Terrorized, intimidated, endangered, by guy on a motorcycle, riding with friends, wearing colors? I’ve known quite a few of those type people. As a matter of fact I would be on a motorcycle, long hair and beard, in leathers, maybe not colors, except a charitable club, if I wasn’t crippled. Not one of the guys I know have ever done any of the things you accuse them of. The ones I know ride to work everyday, home most nights, and get together on weekends. You know seems I remember about 1,000,000 of them riding to DC a couple of years ago to raise awareness of Veterans issues. I also remember every Veterans funeral is escorted by whatever clubs are in the area to keep those a$$holes from Westboro Baptist Church from harassing the soldiers loved ones. Many of them ride weekends to raise money for disabled Vets, children, collect toys for kids at Christmas, and have a deep love for the freedom America grants them to jump on their bike and, ride where they want. Of course the government can’t allow Americans to have that level of freedom anymore. Or the freedom to get together and figure out ways to get that government off their head, and out of their lives.
Ever ask yourself how all those cops, and federal agents knew to be at that restaurant the very day a bunch of a$$holes show up to pick a fight with a group that had been meeting there for a couple of years with no incidents?
You mark my words. You don’t think it can happen to you? They couldn’t destroy the TEA Party with the IRS, they can’t get away with passing new gun laws. Remember the story, They came for the Confederate flag, but I didn’t care because I’m not from the south, etc... Conservatives have already been called terrorists multiple times by this administration. Do you honestly believe the media is gonna tell the truth when they find a reason to kill or arrest us?
I can hear Lester Holt on NBC News now, “A rightwing extremist group was arrested and jailed today for threatening to overthrow the US government.”
You believe what you want, I pray your naivete is born out. I have always been a supporter of police (until they shoot a dog), But this situation is different, and it should be setting off alarms with every Conservative in this country, sadly for too many I fear that alarm wont go until the federal forces are knocking on their door demanding their guns.
As far as those that agree with me that we are not being told the truth by the gov, or the police about what happened in Waco, well you are in the minority, so you’ll either have to suffer who you call fools, or find other activities. I wont be silenced by you or anyone else (exception to JimRob, or admins). I will continue the clarion call anytime I see a clear abuse of power by a government entity.
Which bikers? The Cossacks that showed up to pick a fight with a group that had been meeting at the Twin Peaks restaurant for a couple of years with no incident?
How did the cops and federal agents know to be there in force, on that day, at that time?
The whole thing stinks, smells like bad cheese.
I see you are interacting with two of the Resident Waco Trolls.
Their tactics are as predictable and boring as they are despicable.
They make a very small contribution though, by using their spew to bump a thread so that FReepers with functioning brains can become aware of Waco 5/17.
“Which bikers?”
Peter Graves, Bandidos officer and TCOC president at the Waco shooting, says they respect the police for doing their job.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_sCRg69TQE
(Big John Snyder, Vice president of the Boozefighters at the Waco shooting) “The police were professional, considering the situation they were in. They were professional and doing their job,” he said.
http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-waco-biker-20150519-story.html
We have also heard from a biker family member that the police probably saved lives at Waco.
“But this situation is different”
Yes. It was a gang war in a parking lot, not in a Nevada casino.
” denied access to council for almost a month.”
Did you make that up?
First off, the Bandidos officer you quote is named Jimmy Graves not Peter Graves. Secondly, per the video, he was not even there when everything went down. “He heard”. 3rd. As far a respecting police. That statement had nothing to do with the shooting. That was in response to “have you called for violence against police”. His response “do you think we are crazy? If we killed police President Obama would have the Army, Navy and Air Force after us and do away with us”
So as far as “evidence” of anything the video you posted is less than useless
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