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“Joel Gilbert is nothing but the poor man’s version of Michael Moore, a pathetic little scumbag trying to make a name for himself with sensationalism and controversy imo. The lies he told are beyond counting, the major one, aside from the misidentification of the model as Stanley Ann Dunham, was that he had Frank Marshall Davis living in a building that housed a club that was miles away from the address he gave. It looks like Gilbert falsified the caption relating to an incident he attributed to the Elks Club that never happened. I was sad to see how many wanted to believe Joel Gilbert’s scenario, although it was evident the man was an out and out scam artist and liar.”

I am inclined to agree with you on all of the above! Despite a shared dental feature, the noses, in particular, simply don’t match. The model’s is concave and up-turned and SAD’s is convex and a bit pudgy, at least in the picture at the zoo with little Barry.

None-the-less, FMD had the means, motive and opportunity to have impregnated SAD and to have recruited BHO Sr. as a cover black sperm donor. I say that only a pure speculation with no 1960 evidentiary support.

For whatever it is worth, young Barry’s claimed poetry and claimed interactions in Ayer’s co-written “Dreams” (a totally suspect book) show a disturbing level of intimacy of a pervert-father, victim-son relationship, IMO.

Considering that FMD and BHO Sr. were committed anti-colonial Communists the Dreams from either father were about the same with FMD appearing to have had a much more profound effect on Barry and wired him into the Chicago Marxist Mafia...including Ayers and Ayers parents, who funded part of Barry’s education.

I note that Barry was NOT wired into genuine Islamist anti-Americans in Chicaqo, as might have been expected had Barry any connection to Malcolm X who had dumped NOI for Wahhabism, but it was to the the secular DSA Chicago Marxists and Bill Ayers that he was enmeshed.

Well, well well...look who showed up with a complete change of tone, it's a minor miracle! Let me deal with your points one at a time:

Now what you have to do is explain why no one remembers Stanley Ann Dunham in Hawaii in 1960/61 with the kenyan student, even Neil Abercrombie, who says he saw them together on social occasions, and calls her ANN, might have seen him with the ANNE/USA who is photographed sitting beside him at the Nachannofs, and that's definitely not Stanley Ann Dunham, but Mary, not being prepared, said she babysat IN JANUARY 1961.

Neil Abercrombie says, I was here when that child was born applies equally to the child of ANN who later shows up as ANNA in Seattle, the darker boy of the two, whose name you see on the HAWAII BIRTH INDEX FOR 1960-1964.

The address for ANN S OBAMA in the Hawaii Polk, same address as the Dunhams apparently shared with the Pratt family, for whom Stanley Armour worked...we cannot know who that person was, or IF she actually lived there at all.

The Pratt daughter doesn't remember a young woman with a baby at the address. And she was careful not to say 'I don't remember the Dunham's had a daughter' - So the girl whose name appears in the Hawaii Polk as Ann S Obama Student, might also have been the student enrolled at the U of HI for Fall 1960.

You have no way of knowing for certain that the enrollment information from the U of HI for Fall 1960 and then from Spring 1963 IS FOR THE SAME PERSON. There's no sign of a baby with the Dunhams, but goodness gracious me, suddenly there he is, aged about two and a half and he's sitting on the fence at the zoo and she's there, and it's 1963. Snapshots like that do tell a story.

WHERE WAS HE BEFORE HE SHOWED UP IN 1963?

The FMD-father story falls down if you can't place Stanley Ann Dunham in Hawaii. She showed up with a very young baby at the home of Susan Botkin ( Blake) unable to change a diaper...because the child wasn't hers imo and then she took off and Susan never saw her again.

And that interview was before ANNA OBAMA was found listed in the Polk in Seattle...which opened an entirely unexpected can or worms...and they hurriedly turned her into Stanley Ann Dunham. But Mary goofed because she wasn't prepped, she said she babysat for ANNA in JANUARY 1961.

But there's a photograph taken from the back of a woman holding a little boy at a meeting of the NOI that appeared in April 1962, in Muhammad Speaks, the publication distributed by Malcolm X that looks an awful lot like Stanley-Nanny and the little zero...but we can't know when that photograph was taken, can we? The issue has been removed from the web archive, but I do have a copy...

FMD, being active in an organization known as THE PROTECTION OF THE FOREIGN BORN which was set up to prevents illegals being deported from Hawaii, would have been the perfect choice for any fake paperwork you might need, fake newspaper announcements would have been right up his ally...he was a credited journalist, who was credited with preventing the communist Harry Bridges from being deported from Hawaii. I see him as far more useful in what it took for supplying a false ID, than being a 'sperm donor' as you so indelicately put it. An ugly old man, 35 years older than the high school girl he's rumoured to have seduced, would be a total waste of his usefulness and talent.

The problem you and I have, is that you throw it all in together without any focus other than what you want to see, and it becomes too confusing - it's all forest and no trees.

As I see it, the only time the kenyan claims that the name of his wife is DUNHAM is after he scratched out the name of 'wife' on his application for an extension to remain in the US, and then wrote ANN S DUNHAM.

I'll post it when I find it. One thing at time.