Posted on 08/16/2012 7:43:49 AM PDT by Academiadotorg
Herbert Hoover’s Secret History of the Second World War and its Aftermath.
As it turns out, Hoover stated what would be his central thesis in a conversation at a 1951 Manhattan dinner to a New York public relations man in language that history buffs who associate the former president with the high starch collars he wore would never guess that he would use. “When Roosevelt put America in to help Russia as Hitler invaded in June, 1941,” Hoover said. “We should have let those two bastards annihilate themselves.”
George H. Nash, no mean historian himself, supplied the above anecdote in his introduction to the presidential memoir published more than four decades after the author’s death. Nash edited the volume, which runs to more than 900 pages with footnotes and appendices.
“Hitler’s constant ambition, intention and preparation during eight years had been the conquest of Russia and Eastern Europe and the uprooting of the Communist Vatican in Moscow,” Hoover wrote in one of the notes which Nash appends to the text. “Roosevelt knew in December 1940 and more emphatically in March 1941 that Hitler had turned his military objectives to that purpose.”
“His State Department in mid-January had even warned Russia it was coming.” It turns out that Hoover had a really reliable source providing him with that last tidbit of information—Roosevelt’s Secretary of State, Cordell Hull.
“I met with Secretary of Hull in Washington during February, 1941, to discuss relief matters, subsequent to which we had a general conversation,” Hoover recounted. “In reply to my query as to what the Germans were doing against Russia, Hull told me that they had concentrated 1,250,000 troops along their eastern frontier, and at least 300,000 additional troops on the Bulgarian frontier.”
(Excerpt) Read more at academia.org ...
IIRC, the American left was against US intervention in the war until Hitler attacked the Soviets.
Mark
Fascism and Communism were sweeping the world, even in America.
In the 1930s a man ascended to power in the U.S., he became El Presidente for life, eventually dying in office.
Old George P is laughing somewhere...
Fascism and Communism are sweeping the world, particularly in America. There is no "stopping it" in sight.
Thus falling into FDR’s clever trap. (nodding sagaciously)
Yes, adding another piece to the puzzle FDR had designed the previous March (at the latest), or so sayeth Hoover. The question remains, how did FDR gain the complicity of the U-Boat captains?
I meant if the US had followed Hoover’s idea and stayed out of it.
Stalin was certainly unrealistic about the capabilities of the Soviet Army of 1941, but then is that so hard to believe from a dictator who didn't welcome a contrarian point-of-view?
Don't think so. The German Army was at the end of it's rope by the Winter of 1941. All momentum had been lost in front of Leningrad & Moscow. The units were operating deep inside Russia with few improved roads & rail connections with which to move supplies.
Hitler's scheme to sieze the oil fields of the Caucuses when offensive fighting resumed in 1942 showed that there were too many objectives and insufficient resources. In addition the Lend-Lease supplies were arriving in Soviet ports in vast quantities.
Lastly, Stalin knew by then that the danger posed by Japan in the Far East had passed when Japan "Struck South" after Pearl Harbor. He was now free to shift his Asian troops to the West.
The Russians had even planned for the loss of Moscow, so even had the OKW persuaded Hitler to go for that strategic prize instead of Stalingrad, it wouldn't have made much difference.
You are, of course, quite correct.
Why anybody thought making a treaty with Hitler was a logical thing to do, given his explicit description in Mein Kampf of his attitude that they would only be observed as long as convenient, is quite beyond me.
Stalin also of course did not abide by treaties when inconvenient, and indeed was planning to double-cross Hitler, probably in 1943. He was foiled when the long war in the West that would bleed the Germans for him turned into a very short war indeed. Making his almost complete purge of the Red Army one of the most poorly timed policies in history.
Stalin apparently had some sort of mental breakdown when Hitler beat him to the double-cross. Just wasn’t something he was used to.
But then we make treaties with the Norks, who we KNOW will only abide by them as long as they feel like it. I wish somebody would explain to me what the point of getting a pledge from someone you KNOW is lying is.
Few Americans know that a major reason Japan chose to attack Pearl is that they had the absolute crap kicked out of them in 1939 by the Red Army in Manchuria. Zhukov, who we would hear from again, forced them to fight a stand-up mechanized warfare battle and destroyed something like 3/4 of the Japanese force.
The Japs decided they maybe didn't want to conquer Siberia after all and went with the alternative "Strike South" strategy of the Navy, which, at least in the Jap strategists' minds, required taking out the US Pacific Fleet.
Thus Pearl Harbor.
Due to the US Oil Embargo, the Japanese Navy only had reserves enough for 6 months to a year of combat operations had they not seized the Dutch oil fields (& returned them to operation). Thus the entire IJN might have been literally tied up at the piers if the "Strike South" stategy had not succeeded in gaining approval.
My point was Hitler made several crucial blunders in the Soviet campaign. The generals knew better. That’s why I said IF HITLER HAD LEFT IT TO THE GENERALS.
Germany COULD have defeated the Soviets EXCEPT for blunders made by Hitler.
The biggest mistake Hitler made was treating the Russians like crap....there were plenty of Russians and Ukrainians who would have loved to fight alongside Hitler to get rid of Stalin and the Bolsheviks. But they found out quickly that Hitler was even worse.
Regards,
OC
The Nazis thought the Slaves were little better then the Jews. Actually, the Jews, Gypses, etc were just the first on their hit list.
Sorry, the Slavs.
Sorry, the Slavs.
Some cases the Nazis didn’t worry about the Slavs, in the case of Slovakia and Croatia, they tended to be more pragmatic towards Slavs, they would use them for their ends when warranted. They could have taken that approach regarding the Russians and Ukrainians, many Nazis supported the idea of having General Vlasov raise an anti-Bolshevik Army, but Hitler wanted none of it.
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