Posted on 01/11/2012 8:47:11 PM PST by SeekAndFind
I agree it’s far fetched to believe all this order was created out of pure chaos over a near infinity of time. However, that isn’t the same thing as saying it’s impossible. If something is possible, no matter how improbable, it could happen on the first try. Let’s say you want to roll ten dice at a time and get nothing but sixes one million times in a row. That’s highly improbable but not impossible. That sequence could happen the first time you start rolling or much, much later, but it would eventually occur given enough time.
I think your point is the probability of the universe springing into existence out of chaos is essentially impossible, because there simply isn’t enough time for it to occur. I agree. I believe it’s impossible. I’m a creationist. Nevertheless, I don’t think it’s possible to prove it’s impossible. I doubt anyone could create the math necessary to prove either way, because we are dealing with too many unknowns. It’s not like my dice problem where I set all the parameters.
BTW, I’m only making the point that it’s impossible to prove one way or the other. That’s not a problem for me, because I think it’s far more easy to believe in the Creator than to think all this sprang out of nothing. A Creator not only fits all the other cause and effect observed in the universe, it also seems more probable than this all being created by chance. Either way, you and I cannot prove it.
Even moreso is considering organic chemistry. Yes, it’s incredibly improbable that you can form DNA from what? Again, this isn’t to say that we can’t synthesize incredible chemical compounds from base materials such as sugars or petroleum, but all chemical syntheses require incredibly strict, step by step control of the chemical reaction to work. Even then, you have to sort out what is the genuine product, and what are the isomers. All I am saying is that yes, some things are just rediculous to try and leave it up to saying a random origin produced it, organic chemistry is only part of it, too.
Morpheus2009: “Yes, it’s incredibly improbable that you can form DNA from what?”
Just look at the wonderful complexity around us. I don’t know how one would even begin to make the necessary calculations to determine the probability of DNA, much less an entire universe. It would take an amazing amount of faith to believe all of this was created at random. It’s far easier for me to believe a creator made it. This creator, being outside of the universe, could not be adequately described (measured) using universe-based tools.
Let me put it this way, the complexity of chemistry, gives me great appreciation to the Biblical poetic passage that God created man from the dust. Even today, the creation story goes beyond what one would consider practical from an extremely primitive, and inanimate substance to living matter. It’s an amazing jump in complexity that is perplexing and incredible to look at. If there is ever a science that gives a glimpse at the existence of some greater order and intelligence, chemistry, especially organic, illustrates this fairly well, from my experience.
“I think your point is the probability of the universe springing into existence out of chaos is essentially impossible, because there simply isn’t enough time for it to occur.”
More the compelexity of complex systems within a larger system. The Mona Lisa was a good example. The depth of the painting is beyond chance since chance “resets” at every failure.
I only have one question, why is it that only UNIVERSES can pop into existence from nothing? Why not a horse, dog, my next house?
What ‘rules’ govern NOTHING?
Ok, that was two questions...
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